Thread Subject: Re: Provide highly visible keyboard focus and text cursors
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From: Peter Wallack
Date: Wed, Jun 27 2007 4:40 PM
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I'm trying to figure out who is ultimately responsible for satisfying
this provision. I fully recognize that if I invent my own widgets, it
is entirely up to me. But if I code a simple web page today using
simple components, the browser currently does *something* to indicate
focus on every component. Because of that, can I safely make the
assumption that the browser or OS is responsible for adhering to this
provision, or am I forced to guarantee compliance myself?<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Peter Wallack
Accessibility Program Director
Oracle Corporation</pre>
<br>
<br>
Gregg Vanderheiden wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:017d01c7b8fa$dd32d7a0$a117a8c0@NC84301"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Agree
That is why the provision is OUTCOME oriented rather than method oriented.
It says what the outcome should be but makes not mention of how it should be
met.
Gregg
-- ------------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">-----Original Message-----
From: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = "> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ">mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>] On Behalf
Of Peter Korn
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 3:23 PM
To: TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee
Subject: Re: [teitac-websoftware] Provide highly visible
keyboard focus and text cursors
Gregg,
Many desktops offer a "mouse trails" option, in which the
mouse cursor briefly gets a tail or trail, where the last
~1/2 second of previous positions remain briefly on the
screen to aid in their being located. It is easy to imagine
something like Sean's control key suggestion - a mode in
which the focused item is briefly more significantly visually
indicated - aiding the user in locating it when the TAB key
is pressed.
The larger point I want to make is that there are a variety
of innovative/novel ways in which one could aid users in
visually locating the focused object on the screen. Larger
"marching ants" or other static focus indication is only one
of them. Whatever standard we put forth should be general
enough to allow for new and novel approaches, so long as they
meet the ultimate user need.
Regards,
Peter Korn
Accessibility Architect,
Sun Microsystems, Inc.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Hmmm
Boy - that is a good question. It is marginal at best. Each
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">time I hit
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">the tab key I would have to hit the control key to figure
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">out where it
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">went. Maybe if it did it each time it moved too..? But then
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">you have
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">to change focus to find it. (sounds like the uncertainty principle).
hmmmm
Gregg
-- ------------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">----------------------------------------------------------------------
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">--
*From:* <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = "> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ">mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>] *On
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">Behalf Of
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> *Sean Hayes
*Sent:* Wednesday, June 27, 2007 2:49 PM
*To:* TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee
*Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] Provide highly visible
keyboard focus and text cursors
It turns out I have my display set at 1400x1050, so that might
explain my apparent loss of visual acuity J. I think I have a
better understanding of what you are getting at now, I'll think
about it for a bit.
One more question - if the control key, or similar could be
configured to identify the focused widget in the same way as the
pointer, would that also cover it?
Sean Hayes
Standards and Policy Team
*Corporate Accessibility Group
Microsoft
*Phone:
mob +44 7977 455002
office +44 117 9719730
*From:* <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = "> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ">mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>] *On
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">Behalf Of
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> *Gregg Vanderheiden
*Sent:* 27 June 2007 20:35
*To:* 'TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee'
*Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] Provide highly visible
keyboard focus and text cursors
Not sure I follow what your question/problem is.
It is possible to change the viewing size of the text.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">It does not
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> change the cursor however.
Also, don't know about you but with my glasses on, I
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">can see which
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> side of the comma the cursor is from 2.5 meters at
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">default settings.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> But reading the text from that distance isn't the point. People
with low vision can use close viewing to read text. But
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">they have
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> to look at the full screen to find the cursors.
For you that would be equivalent to finding the cursor
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">location at
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> 2.5 meters, but reading the screen at .5 meters - or
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">maybe 1 meter.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> The control key lets you find the mouse pointer (on windows) but
not the keyboard focus or character input.
Does this help?
Gregg
-- ------------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">----------------------------------------------------------------------
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">--
*From:* <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = "> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ">mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>]
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">*On Behalf
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> Of *Sean Hayes
*Sent:* Wednesday, June 27, 2007 2:19 PM
*To:* TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee
*Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] Provide highly visible
keyboard focus and text cursors
One problem I have with this wording is that at 2.5 meters
most of the UI is unintelligible (although if course that
depends on OS settings); so while /locating/ the
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">element with
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> focus may be possible; determining what the located
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">item /is/
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> would be impossible.
For example I can locate the flashing insertion
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">point in this
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> text from across the room, but determining whether it is
before or after the comma in this sentence eludes me.
So it seems like a very partial interpretation of
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">locate, and
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> I'm having a hard time understanding the user need this
provision is attempting to satisfy. Perhaps the "Windows
magnify with follow focus" mode is in fact a much better
mechanism than drowning the item with a bright
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">yellow triangles.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> Sean Hayes
Standards and Policy Team
*Corporate Accessibility Group
Microsoft
*Phone:
mob +44 7977 455002
office +44 117 9719730
*From:* <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = "> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ">mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = </a>]
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">*On Behalf
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> Of *Gregg Vanderheiden
*Sent:* 27 June 2007 19:28
*To:* 'TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee'
*Subject:* [teitac-websoftware] Provide highly visible
keyboard focus and text cursors
*9.2.2 Provide highly visible keyboard
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">focus and text
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> cursors *
Software shall provide at least one mode where
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">keyboard focus
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> cursors and text cursors shall be visually
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">locatable by people
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> with unimpaired vision at 2.5 meters when software is
displayed on a 38 cm (15 inch) diagonal screen at 1024 x 768
pixels resolution, without moving the cursor.
EXAMPLE 1: The software provides an option of having a thick
rectangle of contrasting color that moves to and
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">outlines the
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""> control or field that has keyboard focus.
EXAMPLE 2: The software provides an option of having bright,
yellow triangles extend from the top and bottom of the text
cursor.
Gregg
------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
Professor - Depts of Ind.__ Engr. & BioMed Engr.
Director - Trace R & D Center
University of Wisconsin-Madison
_<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="http://trace.wisc.edu/"><http://trace.wisc.edu/></a>_ FAX 608/262-8848
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</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">----------------------------------------------------------------------
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">--
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