Thread Subject: Re: Volume gain standard

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From: Gregg Vanderheiden
Date: Sat, Sep 08 2007 11:20 PM

Well the language says to meet 508 the phone has to have 20 db. If the
phones are all fitted with different handsets to meet this - there would be
nothing to prevent this I wouldn't think. If the company wants to outfit
just some of phones - then that is something different. The standards
don't speak to having just some products comply. Or to having products not
comply - but have the possibility to.



You mention headsets and handsets. Only headsets and earphones are
exempted. Not handsets. Perhaps we should make that clearer.



Earphones are exempted for a couple reasons. First - an earphone has no
output until it is plugged into a product. And the output volume is a
function of the input signal from the product. So earphones and headsets
by themselves are not subject to anything.



Second - a product that is not held up to the ear - but just has a headphone
jack - is not covered because earphones have different efficiencies. The
product maker has no idea what the efficiency of the earphone or headset
will be so they cannot predict the volume level that would result. Also -
those that need additional sound level can use headphones or earphones that
would yield whatever level or tone adjustment that would meet their needs.



Handsets on the other hand are part of the product so should be subject to
this.



Make sense?


Gregg
-- ------------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.






_____


From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
[mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Diane Golden
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2007 7:54 PM
To: TEITAC Committee
Subject: Re: [teitac-committee] Volume gain standard

Two issues remain for me --



1) This still leave unclear if the 20 dB gain must be built-in to every
item or if it can be added on via a swapped out handset that has the gain.
It sort of sounds like the swapped out handset or even an add-on in-line
amplifier would work given the statement about swapping out headsets.



2) The exclusion of headsets is still confusing to me. An awful lot of
people with mild-moderate hearing loss who could get by with 20 dB of gain
are not going to be wearing hearing aids. Even if they are wearing hearing
aids, many will use an open fitting which means the headset or handset works
just fine over the hearing aid. If the phone has a "tone" adjustment, I
would say there are at least as many hard of hearing folks who would use the
amplification of the phone over their hearing aids if the 20 dB gain is
enough.



Diane

----- Original Message ----
From: Gregg Vanderheiden < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
To: TEITAC Committee < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Sent: Friday, September 7, 2007 11:33:24 PM
Subject: Re: [teitac-committee] Volume gain standard

Close.

It would read something like

Products designed to be held up to the ear during use and that provide a
function allowing voice communication must provide a gain adjustable from
the normal unamplified level to at least 20 dB above the normal unamplified
level as measured in accordance with the provisions of the FCC regulation
68.317 for volume control. The volume at the normal unamplified level
setting must also meet the requirement in FCC regulation 68.317. (This does
not apply to headphones or headsets where a standard audio connection is
available per AUDIO CONNECTOR PROVISION)



Rationale:
Earbuds etc don't work with hearing aids and in fact go into the ear where
the hearing aid already is. As long as there is an Audio Connection point,
people who use neckloops, or other connections to their hearing aids can
connect or plug in a headset that will meet their needs. Requiring all
headphones and headsets to conform is not necessary since people who need
special ones can obtain them. For volume, there is another problem. Unless
you control the headset AND the device, you cannot determine what the output
of the headset will be due to the fact that they have different
efficiencies. The exception is not for the phone itself but for headsets
and headphones that would be plugged into the phone.




Does this handle the issues?




Gregg
-- ------------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.



> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf
> Of Diane Golden
> Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 11:50 AM
> To: 'TEITAC Committee'
> Subject: [teitac-committee] Volume gain standard
>
> If I understand the discussion correctly, the revised version
> of the volume gain standard would read something like --
>
> "E&IT that provide a function allowing voice communication
> designed to be held up to the ear during use (detachable
> headsets and headphones not
> included) must provide a [built-in? or add-on/substitutable
> component delivered?] gain adjustable from the normal
> unamplified level to at least 20 dB above the normal
> unamplified level as measured in accordance with the
> provisions of the FCC regulation 68.317 for volume control.
> The volume at the normal unamplified level setting must also
> meet the requirement in FCC regulation 68.317."
>
> While I undersand and support the intent of excluding voice
> communication products that do not have control over the end
> receiver unit -- there are many traditional telephone
> products that use headsets and alternatives to handsets as a
> core feature and might be seen as excluded with this language.
> Separately, there still needs to be a decision made regarding
> whether or not the volume gain must be built-in to every
> phone purchased -- rather than being delivered via a
> substituted "special" handset and/or some other form of
> add-on amplifier that is available but not included in every
> phone purchased (see ? language in brackets).
>
> Diane Golden
> NASCIO
>
>

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