Thread Subject: Re: note for focus cursor

Note

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From: Peter Korn
Date: Wed, Sep 12 2007 10:15 PM

Gregg,

The term "access features" is a little imprecise.

Note that 3-P "User Preferences" requires that apps respect a range of
settings - for color, contrast, font type, font size, *and* focus
cursor. So it isn't that apps are "welcome to use" these features; by
this provision, they are required to have a mode that respects them.


Regards,

Peter Korn
Accessibility Architect,
Sun Microsystems, Inc.

> One way to do this would be to only require that apps have access
> features. They are welcome to use platform features if they are there.
>
> If platforms don't provide â it would make it harder on apps â and
> apps could pressure platforms for needed support where it makes sense.
>
> But for THIN platforms â there wouldnât be a failure. Just not good
> support for apps
>
> (note that most platforms are also apps or bundle with apps so they
> will have to do this anyway for themselves.
>
>
> Gregg
> -- ------------------------------
> Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] *On Behalf Of
> *Schomburg, Paul
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 12, 2007 5:03 PM
> *To:* TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee
> *Cc:* Jasionowski, Tony; Schomburg, Paul; Brooner Mary-AMB004
> *Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] note for focus cursor
>
> Folks: Iâd like to indicate a concern with how this requirement
> may be applied to telecom or CE products that would have very thin
> platform software to load applications. I think these products
> would not be able to depend on the platform software to provide
> the desired APIâs because of memory limitations. Therefore, the
> application would have to support all accessibility requirements.
> For this reason I would prefer to retain the language at 3-V that
> makes these requirements optional for âplatform software.â If you
> mean to exclude Telecom & CE by stipulating products with
> âkeyboard operable user interfacesâ I donât think this would
> completely exclude all such products.
>
> Thanks, Paul
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] *On Behalf Of
> *Gregg Vanderheiden
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 12, 2007 5:03 PM
> *To:* 'TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee'
> *Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] note for focus cursor
>
> Ah
>
> Yes â you are right. I missed the second part.
>
> Ok lets look at this approach.
>
> âPlatform software must support at least one mode that provides a
> highly visual indication of which user interface object currently
> has the keyboard focus. Application software that provides user
> interface objects must either use the focus mode provided by the
> platform software or provide such a mode directlyâ
>
> This is sort of workable but the Application has to take more
> responsibility. The system focus may be invisible on their
> background for example.
>
> How about
>
> âPlatform software and applications that have keyboard operable
> user interfaces must support at least one mode that provides a
> highly visual indication of which user interface object currently
> has the keyboard focus. Application may provide the highly visible
> indication directly or by utilizing the platform cursor where
> effective.
>
>
> Gregg
> -- ------------------------------
> Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] *On Behalf
> Of *Sean Hayes
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 12, 2007 2:53 PM
> *To:* TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee
> *Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] note for focus cursor
>
> Itâs the âsoftware must provideâ bit that is the problem.
>
> Its ambiguous whether there is an implied [all] in there.
>
> I disagree that all apps can ignore it, the way i wrote it is
> in two parts:
>
> Part 2 is : Application software that provides user interface
> objects must either use the focus mode provided by the
> platform software or provide such a mode directlyâ
>
> Where does it say, or not do anything at all?
>
> Sean Hayes
> Incubation Lab
> *Accessibility Business Unit
> Microsoft*
>
> * *
>
> *Office: +44 118 909 5867**, *
>
> *Mobile**: +44 **7875 091385*
>
> *From:* = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] *On Behalf
> Of *Gregg Vanderheiden
> *Sent:* 12 September 2007 20:43
> *To:* 'TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee'
> *Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] note for focus cursor
>
> The âone mode thatâ language already allows you to use system
> or platform capabilities to meet it. If the platform doesnât
> have them though, then the app inherits the responsibility.
>
> The way you wrote it â all apps can just ignore the provision
> since it is restricted to the platform â even if the platform
> isnât providing the focus cursor.
>
>
> Gregg
> -- ------------------------------
> Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] *On
> Behalf Of *Sean Hayes
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 12, 2007 2:10 PM
> *To:* TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee
> *Subject:* Re: [teitac-websoftware] note for focus cursor
>
> Thanks, Greg. That does address that concern.
>
> On re-reading the provision however, I have another
> concern with the section :
>
> âSoftware must support at least one mode that ...â
>
> Which implies that the application software must implement
> this itself, but typically it is the platform software
> which provides this functionality for applications, for
> example embodied in a âwidget setâ or library; and even if
> the application designer could override the platform
> behaviour, they typically would not do so in order to fit
> in with the platform user interface guidelines
>
> In the case of a web application it may be the browser or
> plugin which provides this (but not always).
>
> Perhaps a better wording would be something along the
> lines of:
>
> âPlatform software must support at least one mode that
> provides a highly visual indication of which user
> interface object currently has the keyboard focus.
> Application software that provides user interface objects
> must either use the focus mode provided by the platform
> software or provide such a mode directlyâ
>
> Sean Hayes
> Incubation Lab
> *Accessibility Business Unit
> Microsoft*
>
> * *
>
> *Office: +44 118 909 5867**, *
>
> *Mobile**: +44 **7875 091385*
>
> *From:* = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] *On
> Behalf Of *Gregg Vanderheiden
> *Sent:* 12 September 2007 19:39
> *To:* 'TEITAC Web/Software Subcommittee'
> *Subject:* [teitac-websoftware] note for focus cursor
>
> At the very close of the meeting â I noticed that this
> provision does talk about âwithout moving the cursorâ.
> Thus knowledge of the cursor WOULD be required as Sean had
> identified. (apologies Sean). I have edited the note below
> to include his comment (I think).
>
> I also put a generic note for those who are not designing
> software.
>
> * NOTE: A focus cursor that is visually locatable by
> people (familiar with what the focus cursor would
> look like) who have 20/20 vision at 3.5 times the
> typical viewing distance without moving the cursor
> is sufficient.
> * NOTE: Since computer software would be displayed on
> unknown screen sizes: for computer software a focus
> cursor that is visually locatable by people
> (familiar with the cursor) who have 20/20 vision at
> 2.5 meters when software is displayed on a 38 cm (15
> inch) diagonal screen at 1024 x 768 pixels
> resolution, without moving the cursor is sufficient.
>
>
> * *
>
>
> Gregg
>
> ------------------------
>
> Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
> Professor - Depts of Ind. Engr. & BioMed Engr.
> Director - Trace R & D Center
> University of Wisconsin-Madison
> _<http://trace.wisc.edu/>_ FAX 608/262-8848
>
> DSS Player at http://tinyurl.com/dho6b
>
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>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>

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