Thread Subject: Re: FW: FW: Hardware SC ProvisionstoComplete(AudioConnection Jack)

Note

This archival content is maintained by WebAIM and NCDAE on behalf of TEITAC and the U.S. Access Board . Additional details on the updates to section 508 and section 255 can be found at the Access Board web site.

From: Brooner Mary-AMB004
Date: Fri, Oct 19 2007 2:30 PM

Rob -

This one stumps me... This says that a B/T wireless connection (it is an
industry standard connection) has to have a jack adapter? That's just
weird and doesn't seem very smart to me.

Mary Brooner

-----Original Message-----
From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
[mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 4:08 PM
To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
Subject: [teitac-committee] FW: FW: Hardware SC
ProvisionstoComplete(AudioConnection Jack)

Clarified with Gregg, the following language is what is being
recommended for consideration by TEITAC

2.1-C When products provide auditory output beyond simple tonal
feedback or signaling, the audio signal must be provided through an
industry standard connection that will allow for private listening.

* Public-shared products must provide the connection via a standard
2.5mm or 3.5mm phone jack or RCA audio jack.

* Personal-private products must provide either a 2.5mm or 3.5mm phone
jack or a wired or wireless connection that has a 2.5mm or 3.5mm phone
jack adapter that is commonly available.



-----Original Message-----
From: Gregg Vanderheiden [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 12:21 PM
To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ; 'TEITAC Committee'; Nerhood, Robert;
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
Subject: RE: [teitac-committee] FW: Hardware SC Provisions
toComplete(AudioConnection Jack)

I'm sorry

This is being advanced as a recommendation from the Hardware committee
and
had input from closed committee as well. I'm not sure why it should be
changed this radically without review by either committee?


Gregg
-- ------------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.



> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Mike
> Paciello
> Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 11:28 AM
> To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ;
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ; = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> Subject: Re: [teitac-committee] FW: Hardware SC Provisions
> toComplete(AudioConnection Jack)
>
> Agreed. Brenda?
>
>
> Mike Paciello
> Cell: +1.603.566.7713
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 12:26 PM
> To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ;
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ; = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> Subject: RE: [teitac-committee] FW: Hardware SC Provisions to
> Complete(AudioConnection Jack)
>
> Since the original proposal was worked out between Mike & Brenda, I'd
> like to have Brenda's feedback on these changes.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Mike
> Paciello
> Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 10:07 AM
> To: 'TEITAC Committee'
> Subject: Re: [teitac-committee] FW: Hardware SC Provisions to
> Complete(AudioConnection Jack)
>
> This works for me...
>
> - Mike
>
>
> Mike Paciello
> Cell: +1.603.566.7713
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Gregg
> Vanderheiden
> Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 10:04 AM
> To: 'TEITAC Committee'
> Subject: Re: [teitac-committee] FW: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete

> (AudioConnection Jack)
>
> Hi Rob.
>
> This language inadvertently changes the provision from being a
> requirement for a standard connector to being a requirement for a
> signal level only.
> It
> also loses the standard connector for public systems that closed
> products needs.
>
> Actually, we don't need to put the 'standard signal level'
> part in there I don't believe. It is so common for each connector
> type that specifying the connector will automatically lead to a proper

> signal level.
>
>
>
>
> How about the following that combines various suggestions on the list
> and from EWG.
>
>
>
>
> 2.1-C When products provide auditory output beyond simple tonal
> feedback or signaling, the audio signal must be provided through an
> industry standard connection that will allow for private listening.
>
> * Public-shared products must provide the connection via a
> standard 2.5mm or 3.5mm phone jack or RCA audio jack.
>
> * Personal-private products must provide either a 2.5mm or 3.5mm
> phone jack or a wired or wireless connection that has a 2.5mm or 3.5mm

> phone jack adapter that is commonly available.
>
>
>
>
>
> Are we meeting tomorrow?
>
> Gregg
> -- ------------------------------
> Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > [mailto:teitac-committee- = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of
> > = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 4:14 PM
> > To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > Subject: [teitac-committee] FW: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete
> > (AudioConnection Jack)
> >
> > Here is a recommended revision to 2.2-c.
> >
> > "When products provide auditory output beyond simple tonal
> feedback or
>
> > signaling, the audio signal must be provided at a signal level that
> > allows for private listening through an industry standard
> connection."
> >
> > Hardware SC is fine with this and moving to full committee.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Mike Paciello [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> > Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 4:10 PM
> > To: Nerhood, Robert
> > Subject: FW: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete (Audio Connection
> > Jack)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Mike Paciello
> > Cell: +1.603.566.7713
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 11:59 PM
> > To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > Subject: Re: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete (Audio Connection
> > Jack)
> >
> > Wow. You are nothing if not tenacious. I think your new wording is
> good.
> > Otherwise I bekieve there will be questions as to what the standard
> > signal is Thanks very much Brenda Sent from my Verizon Wireless
> > BlackBerry
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: "Mike Paciello" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> >
> > Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 20:38:18
> > To:"Brenda Battat" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > Cc:"TEITAC
> > desktop/portable (hardware) subcommittee"
> > < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> > Subject: RE: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete (Audio Connection
> > Jack)
> >
> >
> > Hi Brenda -
> >
> > Well it took me a little while, but I finally figured out where the
> phrase,
> > "standard signal level" came from! It was based on a recommendation
> > from Paul Schomburg on September 24th. Please note his email thread
> > posted to this listserv at:
> > http://teitac.org/mailarchives/mail_thread.php?thread=1571#post1
> > <http://teitac.org/mailarchives/mail_thread.php?thread=1571#post1>
> >
> > We've adjusted Paul's wording in the 2.2-C Audio Connection
> provision
> > a bit, but to quote Paul, he stated the following:
> >
> > "...I think standard 'RCA' audio outputs provide sufficient
> > connections to enable headphone connections. Since these
> connections
> > are available on almost every kind of consumer electronics A/V
> > entertainment product I do not feel a requirement to have a 2.5 mm
> > jack is necessary. I'd suggest the following wording:
> >
> > 'Products designed to be used in public places must provide the
> > connection via an industry standard 2.5mm or 3.5mm audio
> jack at the
> > standard signal levels used for headphones/headsets or
> provide a RCA
> > audio output for connection to a 2.5mm or 3.5mm phone jack
> adapter.' "
> >
> > However, this still leaves us with the action item of
> better defining
> > "standard signal level". My hope is that either Paul or Gregg V.,
> > might be able to shed some light on this topic. I've spent
> close to a
> > week searching a number of specifictations and archives and
> I've yet
> > to find anything that defines a "standard audio signal".
> >
> > I wonder if the answer is to adjust the wording as follows:
> >
> > "When products provide auditory output beyond simple tonal
> feedback or
>
> > signaling, the audio signal must be provided at a signal level that
> > allows for private listening through an industry standard
> connection."
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > - Mike
> >
> > Mike Paciello
> > Cell: +1.603.566.7713
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------
> > From: Brenda Battat [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> > Sent: Monday, October 15, 2007 3:04 PM
> > To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > Cc: Randy Marsden; = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > Subject: RE: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete (Audio Connection
> > Jack)
> >
> >
> >
> > Mike
> > Jack size is fine as it covers jacks for headphones and
> jack for cell
> > phones. And RJ9 adapters are available for someone requesting an
> > in-line amplifier through Sec 504
> >
> > I seem to remember some discussion about clarifying that it was
> > located in a public place and used by the public
> >
> > What is the standard signal level?
> >
> >
> > ----------------
> > From: Mike Paciello [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> > Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 7:21 AM
> > To: Brenda Battat
> > Cc: 'Randy Marsden'; = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ; Paciello, Mike
> > Subject: FW: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete (Audio Connection
> > Jack)
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Brenda -
> >
> > Randy Mardsen, Rob Nerhood and I are trying to close the
> loop on the
> > hardware provisions. We're down to two or three small edits. One
> > involves the Audio Connection provision. At our September TEITAC
> > meetings we were discussing the size of the connector jack.
> >
> > The current provision with notes is as follows:
> >
> >
> > 2.2-C - Audio Connection
> >
> > When products provide auditory output beyond simple tonal
> feedback or
> > signaling, the audio signal must be provided at a standard signal
> > level through an industry standard connection that will allow for
> > private listening.
> >
> > * If the product is a public-shared product then the
> connection must
> > be via a standard 2.5mm or 3.5mm audio jack.
> >
> >
> > * If the product is personal-private product then the
> connection can
> > be wired or wireless as long as a 2.5mm or 3.5mm phone jack
> adapter is
>
> > available from the manufacturer.
> >
> > Alternate wording for clarity
> >
> > * Public-shared products must provide the connection via a standard
> > 2.5mm or 3.5mm audio jack.
> >
> >
> > * Personal-private products may provide either a wired or wireless
> > connection. A wired connection must be via a standard 2.5mm
> or 3.5mm
> > audio jack. A wireless connection may be used as long as a 2.5mm or
> > 3.5mm phone jack adapter is available from the manufacturer.
> > Discussion on Work in Progress: * Need to be more specific about
> > "standard signal level" * Need to check against the definitions for
> > public-shared and personal-private to be sure they work for this
> > provision (or define the distinction here).
> >
> ======================================================================
> > ====
> > ==
> > =
> > >From what I can see, it appears that we have agreed to alternate
> > >wording
> > for
> > clarity. That seems fine. We simply need to confirm the jack size
> > specifications. We also need to clarify "standard signal level".
> >
> > - Mike
> >
> > Mike Paciello
> > Cell: +1.603.566.7713
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------
> > From: Randy Marsden [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> > Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 2:28 AM
> > To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > Cc: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > Subject: Re: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete
> >
> >
> > Hi Guys:
> >
> >
> > My apologies for being MIA - I have a lot going on in Madentec right
> now.
> > I
> > believe Audio Connection is mine. I think we had it near
> completion at
>
> > the last TEITAC, but there were some questions about the size of the
> jacks.
> > The
> > TEITAC member representing the deaf community (sorry, I forgot her
> > name) was going to connect with me with advice on that. I haven't
> > closed that loop yet. Mike - do you know her name and contact info?
> >
> >
> > -Randy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Oct 12, 2007, at 6:16 PM, Mike Paciello wrote:
> >
> > Hi Rob -
> >
> > No problem. I'm looking at the spreadsheet as my guide. So
> thanks for
> > the quick update. I talked to TelComm today and they
> acknowledged 2.25
>
> > is theirs. I saw the traffic on contrast, so let's be sure
> we get that
>
> > one closed out on Tuesday. Freestanding -- yes, your
> correct. I just
> > checked my notes. Touch operated, I'll check with Debbie Cook too.
> > Let's add Audio Connection to Tuesday's discussion as well.
> >
> > - Mike
> >
> > Mike Paciello
> > Cell: +1.603.566.7713
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------
> > From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > ]
> > Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 7:27 PM
> > To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > ;
>
> > = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> > Subject: RE: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete
> >
> >
> >
> > Mike,
> >
> > Sorry been out of office all day. Here's my understanding.
> >
> >
> > A) Contrast Ratio (values-only) for 2.1.A - being worked on - see
> > teitac listserv traffic
> > B) Touch Operated - 2.1.B - No update - I thought
> self-contained was
> > tackling this one. Randy?
> > C) Interfearance with Hearing Aids - 2.2.B (with Telcom) - Purely
> > telecom
> > D) Audio Connection - 2.2.C - oops
> > E) FreeStanding definition. - I thought we agreed at last
> plenary that
>
> > since this is undefined in ADAAG then it remains undefined in 508.
> > Sorry if I'm mistaken.
> > Thanks,
> > Rob
> >
> >
> > ----------------
> > From: Mike Paciello [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > ]
> > Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 2:10 PM
> > To: Nerhood, Robert; = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> > Cc: Paciello, Mike
> > Subject: Hardware SC Provisions to Complete
> >
> >
> >
> > Rob/Randy -
> >
> > Here are the provisions we still need to get done:
> >
> > A) Contrast Ratio (values-only) for 2.1.A
> > B) Touch Operated - 2.1.B
> > C) Interfearance with Hearing Aids - 2.2.B (with Telcom)
> > D) Audio Connection - 2.2.C
> > E) FreeStanding definition.
> > I believe that the brief discussion I saw involving Rob's
> > clarification around luminosity contrast (2.1.B) get's us to a 'go'
> > state. We need to get a little clarity on the notes (per Gregg's
> > comments). Any chance of being able to bring these all to
> discussion
> > during the Tuesday conference call?
> > What can I do to help?
> >
> >
> > -Mike
> >
> >
> > Mike Paciello
> > Founder & Principal, TPG
> > Tel: +1 603.882.4122 ext 103
> > Cell: +1 603.566.7713
> > e-mail: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> > <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> > web: www.paciellogroup.com <http://www.paciellogroup.com/>
> >
> >
> >
> > Randy Marsden
> > President, Madentec Limited
> > Tel: 780-450-8926 Ext. 223
> > Fax: 780-988-6182
> > = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> >
> >
> >

WebAIM is an initiative of:
Center for Persons with Disabilities (CPD) Utah State University