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Re: Alternate text for images having caption adjacent

for

From: Rakesh P
Date: May 30, 2014 11:13AM


Thanks all for your suggestions. I have come to half-hearted
conclusion as follows.
1. If caption is available after the image and content follows the
caption, I will leave image with alt="". I will recommend the word
photo , screenshot etc along with the caption atleast as offscreen
text.
2. If caption is not available after the image , I will recommend
alternate text for the image, and the description of the image
follows it.
In this way we can reduce the verbos for screen reader user, and in
both the cases user will know the availability of image.

Thanks & Regards
Rakesh
On 5/30/14, Rakesh P < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> On 5/30/14, Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
>>> I totally agree with you Jared in regard with verbos, but my concern is
>> Consider If alt="" is used instead of "Image of or photo of Jared" in
>> alternate text, screen reader will not announce that an image of Jared is
>> available in the
>>
>> Yes, this does get tricky. It really depends on the situation. For
>> example, a caption of me at a tweetup might state "Jon at the CSUN
>> tweetup". But the alt text might explain a lot more detail such as the
>> funny hat I'm wearing or the Got 508? T-shirt I'm wearing, etc. What the
>> image is conveying may very widely. For example, if my profile picture
>> shows me hiking as sighted person could infer I like or have been hiking
>> and a simple caption of "Jon Avila" wouldn't tell the user is blind and
>> visually impaired that information -- such information could be useful in
>> networking, etc.
>>
>> Jonathan
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: <EMAIL REMOVED>
>> [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of Rakesh P
>> Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:57 PM
>> To: WebAIM Discussion List
>> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Alternate text for images having caption adjacent
>>
>> <Jared wrote:
>> But, I think this requirement often results in less-than-optimal
>> accessibility. Consider a photo of me in a web page with text immediately
>> below it of "Jared Smith". Based on this definition, one would have to
>> either provide alternative text that is redundant to the actual text, or
>> do something like this:
>>
>> Jared Smith
>>
>> This is certainly not useful or efficient. The content of the image is
>> that it's me, Jared Smith, so why require verbose or unnecessary text
>> references to that content from the image itself? Consider the overhead
>> of
>> dozens of these types of alt attribute references (alt="Product image.
>> Product title is below."???) for every product image on a shopping web
>> site.>
>>
>> I totally agree with you Jared in regard with verbos, but my concern is
>> Consider If alt="" is used instead of "Image of or photo of Jared" in
>> alternate text, screen reader will not announce that an image of Jared is
>> available in the web page. If I want to ask my sited friend to explain
>> how
>> Jared looks. Tall, fair, with blue eyes etc. alt="" will not allow me to
>> do so.
>> (I am a screen reader user just trying to put my perspective not to go
>> into personal details though) Thanks & Regards Rakesh On 5/28/14, Whitney
>> Quesenbery < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
>>> I'd like to push the discussion of captions v. alt text a little
>> further.
>>>
>>> I work on a UX magazine, where we try to take accessibility seriously
>>> and regularly publish articles on the topic. Many of our articles
>>> include illustrations that are screenshots or images of other design
>>> artifacts. All of our illustrations have captions, and a direct
>> reference in the text.
>>>
>>> The work of making the captions and alt text work together is one of
>>> our ongoing discussions. I'd love any input, beyond the usual rules
>>> for alt text, as I'm working on a style guide for our authors and
>> editors.
>>>
>>> 1. If the *content* of the screenshot is not very important, do not
>>> transcribe the text. The alt text briefly adds any descriptive details
>>> that help someone visualize the image and make sense of the example.
>>>
>>> If the *content* is important, use the alt text to identify the
>>> content (say, repeat the title of the form or content being
>>> illustrated). Include a box at the end of the article with the full
>>> text. (And even here, transcribe only the part of the screen that is
>>> important to illustrating the point.) Add a link in the caption (where
>>> it's possible technically) that points to the long description in the
>> box.
>>>
>>> 2. If the screenshot is compared to another, and well described in
>>> caption or text, the alt text says whether it's the "before" or
>>> "after" (or
>>> good/bad) image, in case a reader wants to know which is which.
>>>
>>> If the comparison is sensory, echo words from the article to
>>> characterize the visual impact. (For example: "Screen showing bland
>>> clip art" and "Screen showing vibrant images")
>>>
>>>
>>> 3. Avoid de-minimus descriptions like "photo" in favor of what it's a
>>> photo of. We use a word to describe the image only if the visual style
>> matters.
>>> (For example "Hand-drawn sketch" or "Visual mock-up" or "Screenshot".)
>>>
>>> 4. Think about how the alt text and caption read together, trying to
>>> make them work as a coherent information unit
>>>
>>> Don't hide any generally meaningful information in the alt text. Put
>>> that in the caption, even if it makes a slightly longer caption.
>>>
>>> Our alt text is sometimes longer than usual suggestions when the extra
>>> words are helpful in understanding the design
>>>
>>>
>>> Whitney
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 3:33 PM, Jared Smith < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 1:09 PM, Jonathan Avila wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Alt text may often be different from a caption.
>>>>
>>>> Indeed. And in this case, the image would need an alt attribute value
>>>> in addition to the caption.
>>>>
>>>> > For example, a caption might be "Washington crossing the Delaware",
>>>> > but
>>>> the
>>>> > alt text for the picture would in most situations need to describe
>>>> > more than that to be a replacement of the image for someone who
>>>> > could not see it.
>>>>
>>>> Yep, but if the full alternative *is* in context, adding
>>>> alt="Painting. The description is in the text below." is silly and
>>>> doesn't resemble alternative text at all, but it is what the WCAG
>>>> definition and techniques suggest is necessary for conformance.
>>>>
>>>> Jared
>>>> >>>> >>>> list messages to <EMAIL REMOVED>
>>>>
>>> >>> >>> list messages to <EMAIL REMOVED>
>>>
>> >> >> messages to <EMAIL REMOVED>
>> >> >> >>
>