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Re: WCAG and role="presentation"

for

From: Steve Faulkner
Date: Aug 23, 2017 9:07AM

Note: It is a HTML5 conformance error

If a table is to be used for layout it must be marked with the attribute
> role="presentation" for a user agent to properly represent the table to
> an assistive technology and to properly convey the intent of the author to
> tools that wish to extract tabular data from the document.
>
http://w3c.github.io/html/tabular-data.html#the-table-element




--

Regards

SteveF
Current Standards Work @W3C
<http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-standards-work-at-w3c/>;

On 23 August 2017 at 15:37, Sailesh Panchang < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
wrote:

> This does not fail WCAG 2.0 as others before me point out. I term it
> as a best practice that enhance user experience for SR users. This was
> one of the examples in my CSUN 2016 presentation that attempted to
> define the term accessibility best practices.
> Best wishes,
>
> On 8/23/17, Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> >> Let's also keep in mind that using role="presentation" is easy.
> >
> > While I think we'd all agree that it is best to use role presentation --
> the
> > question is whether it is a violation of WCAG. If table markup is not
> used
> > with TH, scope or other header association markup then the table is not
> > identifying header cells and it can be programmatically determined that
> the
> > table is a layout table. Since WCAG 2 was written without relying on
> ARIA
> > and was written before the ARIA spec was finalized -- the supporting
> > document seem to indicate that it's not a failure of WCAG as long as not
> > using role presentation is accessibility supported. However we don't
> have
> > specific guidance on this and others are likely to disagree.
> >
> > Ideally these are the types of things that need to be clearly defined in
> > supporting documents so we can achieve consistency with testing tools and
> > with conformance evaluations. Questions such as this can be raised with
> > the Accessibility Guidelines Working Group on Github
> > (https://github.com/w3c/wcag/issues). If you feel strongly about
> something
> > it might be helpful to put together a suggested failure technique --
> > although getting failure techniques accepted has been proven difficult.
> >
> > Jonathan
> >
> > Jonathan Avila
> > Chief Accessibility Officer
> > Level Access, inc. (formerly SSB BART Group, inc.)
> > (703) 637-8957
> > <EMAIL REMOVED>
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> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
> Behalf
> > Of Birkir R. Gunnarsson
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2017 9:28 AM
> > To: Lovely, Brian (CONT) < <EMAIL REMOVED> >; WebAIM
> Discussion
> > List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> > Subject: Re: [WebAIM] WCAG and role="presentation"
> >
> > Well put Brian.
> > Let's also keep in mind that using role="presentation" is easy.
> > You add this attribute where appropriate. It does not trigger additional
> > functionality testing(except with a screen reader) and it does not change
> > the webpage appearance so you don't have to get designers involved.
> >
> > And if you are consistently using a semantic element to achieve a certain
> > appearance (or for other non semantic purposes), you really should take a
> > look at the design in general (if you have that luxury) to figure out
> why.
> > It may have other consequences, or break after user agent updates.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/23/17, Lovely, Brian (CONT) via WebAIM-Forum
> > < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> >> I would call out a page for a table containing non-tabular data.
> >>
> >> The role of presentation strips an element of its semantic meaning
> >> (essentially converting it to the equivalent of a non-semantic
> >> container like a div or span). The semantic meaning of elements is an
> >> important part of accessibility, particularly actionable elements. Use
> >> of the correct semantic element provides information about the type of
> >> information presented, and how the element can be successfully
> >> interacted with. I'm not always a "slippery slope" kind of guy, but
> >> once you start to erode the trust in the semantic information you
> >> present, the user really doesn't know what to expect and must take the
> >> extra time and energy to determine if elements are actually what they
> >> are presenting themselves to be, and if those elements actually behave
> as
> >> expected.
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
> >> Behalf Of Peter Shikli
> >> Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 5:33 PM
> >> To: WebAIM Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> >> Subject: [WebAIM] WCAG and role="presentation"
> >>
> >> My question is whether it is a violation to not use
> >> role="presentation" on elements which are used for presentation
> >> purposes only, such as tables. I realize we should use it for
> >> decorative tables, but is it a requirement for a Level AA rating per
> >> WCAG Success Guideline 1.3.1 "Info and Relationships"?
> >>
> >> Understanding WCAG 2.0, http://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/
> >> states that when possible, information presented visually should also
> >> be made available programmatically. Many examples are given, but I
> >> would like some clarification specifically on the use of WAI-ARIA's
> >> role="presentation."
> >>
> >> Sincerely,
> >> Peter Shikli
> >> <EMAIL REMOVED>
> >> 503-570-6831
> >> FAX: 213-337-7029
> >> Access2online
> >> 29030 SW Town Center Loop East
> >> Suite 202-187
> >> Wilsonville, OR 97070
> >> www.Access2online.com
> >> Prison inmates helping websites become accessible
> >>
> >>
> >> > >> > >> archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> >> > >> > >>
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> >
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>
>
> --
> Sailesh Panchang
> Principal Accessibility Consultant
> Deque Systems Inc
> Phone 703-225-0380 ext 105
> Mobile: 571-344-1765
> > > > >