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Re: Link vs Button for "Cancel"

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From: Don Mauck
Date: Jan 9, 2018 8:50AM

I disagree, from a training and support standpoint, if you tell someone to find a button, that's what they would expect to find. It is fine if you visual folks want things to look a certain way, but if you want it to look like a button, then at least use a "role=button". To me, any action control would be a button. Cancel may leave a page, however, I see in many of our applications "cancel" performs a partial page refresh, thus never leaving the page. I believe that in general, buttons perform actions and links take you somewhere even if it is on the same page.
I think we need to remember that not all users will understand that when told to find a "button," it could be a link instead. No need to make things any more convoluted than necessary.

-----Original Message-----
From: Birkir R. Gunnarsson [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ]
Sent: Tuesday, January 9, 2018 8:37 AM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Link vs Button for "Cancel"

It's a double edged sword.
If HTML was as strict as C# or what have you, I doubt the internet would ever have took off.
Most people with a little patience can create a webpage. Not a beautiful, attractive, interactive and rich webpage, but a functional webpage that displays text and images.
If their compiler had failed their code for a small semantic error, they would have given up.

But it makes HTML messy, confusing and allows people who don't have the faintest idea how to code good HTML to have a website.

I'm in the "we're over analyzing" camp on links vs. buttons.
In fact I think the "cancel" action should be a link rather than a button. It navigates you away from the page without taking an action (granted it takes an implicit action by eliminating all the data you provided).
The problem in this particular setup, in my opinion, is that the cancel link shouldn't look like a button.

I wrote a long piece on links vs. buttons once. I never got around to publishing it, but I became increasingly convinced that we are spending too much energy focusing on this vs. other issues such as keyboard accessibility, semantics, color contrast and clarity of content.
If it has the approximate appropriate text for the job and if it shows up in the expected location, the user will try to click it. A keyboard only user will try to activate it. If spacebar doesn't work, he will try the enter key, The enter key will work.

I'm not saying this discussion is invalid or that there isn't a problem, I am just saying that this is hardly ever going to be a user blocker.
Cheers
-B

On 1/9/18, JP Jamous < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> Brian,
>
> I sure agree with you guys. Stick to proper HTML semantic.
> Unfortunately, that's not the facts of the real world.
>
> I preach in all of my training classes and workshops to stick to
> proper HTML semantic. Yet, the resistance with the addition to
> presenting A11Y as a positive component of the SDLC force us to bend the rules.
>
> High jacking a link is definitely not a proper HTML semantic, but HTML
> was all built wrong from the beginning. I am talking back into the
> 90's. That's why I love coding with strict languages like C++, C#.NET, VB.NET and SQL.
> One tiny mistake and that compiler gets ticked off and comes back at
> the developer with an angry face. I wish there is such a thing for
> HTML besides the W3C validator.
>
> I think of those native coding languages as professional boxing,
> whereas HTML is street fighting. Use whatever means to win even if
> they are against the rules. *Smiles*
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
> Behalf Of Lovely, Brian via WebAIM-Forum
> Sent: Tuesday, January 9, 2018 8:05 AM
> To: <EMAIL REMOVED> ; WebAIM Discussion List
> < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Link vs Button for "Cancel"
>
>>>>>>>Personally, I have a feeling that normal people (people who are
>>>>>>>not technologists like us) do not have such a technical view of links vs.
> buttons.
>
> I support the "acts like a link = link, acts like a button = button"
> practice. I also tend to walk on the right in hallways, go through the
> right hand door, etc. I don't know if other people do this consciously
> or not, but I do see a significant percentage of people doing the same
> thing (I'm in the US, btw). I'm sure there are people to whom this
> doesn't occur (non-technologists, so to speak), but in general I think
> this is a good way to ensure foot traffic flow. Whether or not it is
> universally understood, the link/button practice is logical and will,
> worst case scenario, benefit those who are aware of it. Best case
> scenario, it will become universally accepted and will be a logical
> and useful practice, whereas assigning roles randomly will never provide any added benefit.
> >
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