E-mail List Archives

Search E-mail List Archives for

Number of posts in this thread: 5 (In chronological order)

From: Greg Gamble
Date: Mon, May 06 2013 12:50PM
Subject: Should a web site look and read the same
No previous message | Next message →

All,
Don't know if this has been discussed before, but ...

Should a web site Look and Read the same for both sighted users and those using assistive technology?

I ask for a few reasons ..


* Assistive users want/need extra text that we usually hide off screen ...

* Form presentation can be different, such as

o marking required fields

o using input masks to restrict input

o tool tips

o modal popups

o ... and other "Web 2.0" features.

I understand the reasoning to make sites more accessible, and totally agree with it. But I also hear that we should make it so there is no extra or missing content for either type of user, that they should both be getting the same experience ... that I have a problem with. Individuals using assistive technology, no matter what the type, in my opinion, are going to have a different experience. For example, I've lost my sense of smell so can't experience the smell of a new rose. But I can see its beauty. My wife can experience both. I like them for what they look like, she on how they smell and look ... different experience's.

So ... I, as a developer, should try and minimize the differences in a sites functionally, but what about the rest?

Thanks for any help on this ...

Greg Gamble
Information ServicesWashington State Board for Community & Technical Colleges
1300 Quince St SE | PO Box 42495 | Olympia, Washington 98504
p: (360) 704-4376
e: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > | www.sbctc.edu<;http://www.sbctc.edu/>;

From: Lucy Greco
Date: Mon, May 06 2013 1:01PM
Subject: Re: Should a web site look and read the same
← Previous message | Next message →

Hello:
The reason to try your best to make a site look and sound the same is
that when a person is calling tech support or working with a sited friend
to use the site if the blind user can't find what the sited person is
referring to i.e. the go button and it turns out the go button is a link
not a button and or is labeled submit not go. Yes I have seen this. it's
very easy to get lost and frustrated. It is useful to add off screen text
but only to indicate things that might not be perceived in the audio
layout if it can't be seen. I like using off screen text for example for
adding the word required to a field label because I and many other screen
reader users do not have punctuation spoken and might miss the * that
sited users see and recognizes. I hope this helps Lucy

Lucia Greco
Web Access Analyst
IST-Campus Technology Services
University of California, Berkeley
(510) 289-6008 skype: lucia1-greco
http://webaccess.berkeley.edu
Follow me on twitter @accessaces

From: GF Mueden
Date: Mon, May 06 2013 8:26PM
Subject: Re: Should a web site look and read the same
← Previous message | Next message →

Greg, please make them adjustable. It would be unreasonable for me to
deny graphics to others, but I think it reasonable to ask a way to
remove an elemrnt that hurts my eyes and prevents me from reading
adjacent copy.

Alas, I will miss rhis because I will be away for a week.
George


On 5/6/2013 2:50 PM, Greg Gamble wrote:
> All,
> Don't know if this has been discussed before, but ...
>
> Should a web site Look and Read the same for both sighted users and those using assistive technology?
>
> I ask for a few reasons ..
>
>
> * Assistive users want/need extra text that we usually hide off screen ...
>
> * Form presentation can be different, such as
>
> o marking required fields
>
> o using input masks to restrict input
>
> o tool tips
>
> o modal popups
>
> o ... and other "Web 2.0" features.
>
> I understand the reasoning to make sites more accessible, and totally agree with it. But I also hear that we should make it so there is no extra or missing content for either type of user, that they should both be getting the same experience ... that I have a problem with. Individuals using assistive technology, no matter what the type, in my opinion, are going to have a different experience. For example, I've lost my sense of smell so can't experience the smell of a new rose. But I can see its beauty. My wife can experience both. I like them for what they look like, she on how they smell and look ... different experience's.
>
> So ... I, as a developer, should try and minimize the differences in a sites functionally, but what about the rest?
>
> Thanks for any help on this ...
>
> Greg Gamble
> Information Services> Washington State Board for Community & Technical Colleges
> 1300 Quince St SE | PO Box 42495 | Olympia, Washington 98504
> p: (360) 704-4376
> e: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > | www.sbctc.edu<;http://www.sbctc.edu/>;
>
> > > >

From: Tim Harshbarger
Date: Tue, May 07 2013 6:34AM
Subject: Re: Should a web site look and read the same
← Previous message | Next message →

Greg,

Here is another way to think of this issue.

Typically, sites don't include a label for a search field. However, when the site is designed, there are visual cues used to indicate that the text field is a search field. No one just adds a text field to the design and hopes that people visually will be able to figure it out. Since someone who is blind can't utilize those visual cues, you may add off screen text to help make it obvious to the blind user that the text field is a search field. That is the kind of "same" we often mean when we talk about accessible design.

If I rightly understand what you wrote, then I agree with you. Someone who is sighted and someone who is blind will not have the same sensorial experience. However, they can have the same user experience in that they both can complete the same tasks for which the user interface was designed. Experience. That is they both can complete the same tasks.

If you want to read more on the topic, I would suggest reading about the 4 principles of WCAG 2.0: Perceivable, Operable, Understandable, and Robust. When you read about them, I think it will explain better than I can how things are the same and how they differ.

Thanks,
Tim

From: Walt Stover
Date: Tue, May 07 2013 6:40AM
Subject: Re: Should a web site look and read the same
← Previous message | No next message

Greg,

As a screen reader user as long as I receive the information that is
all I am worried about, I have seen some webpages that offer a webpage
for screen reader users but they aren't very good just an example is
amazon. Don't know if this helps or not.
Walt Stover

On 5/7/13, Tim Harshbarger < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Greg,
>
> Here is another way to think of this issue.
>
> Typically, sites don't include a label for a search field. However, when the
> site is designed, there are visual cues used to indicate that the text field
> is a search field. No one just adds a text field to the design and hopes
> that people visually will be able to figure it out. Since someone who is
> blind can't utilize those visual cues, you may add off screen text to help
> make it obvious to the blind user that the text field is a search field.
> That is the kind of "same" we often mean when we talk about accessible
> design.
>
> If I rightly understand what you wrote, then I agree with you. Someone who
> is sighted and someone who is blind will not have the same sensorial
> experience. However, they can have the same user experience in that they
> both can complete the same tasks for which the user interface was designed.
> Experience. That is they both can complete the same tasks.
>
> If you want to read more on the topic, I would suggest reading about the 4
> principles of WCAG 2.0: Perceivable, Operable, Understandable, and Robust.
> When you read about them, I think it will explain better than I can how
> things are the same and how they differ.
>
> Thanks,
> Tim
>