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Thread: Transcript question
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From: Kathryn.Frederick@ood.ohio.gov
Date: Tue, Apr 07 2020 2:20PM
Subject: Transcript question
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Good Afternoon,
I have an auto-generated caption file I'm working with to generate a transcript. I've found and read the WCAG guidance, but am wondering how much editing is appropriate for the transcript from the auto-generated caption file? When I say editing I'm talking about things like speech patterns, punctuation, etc. Per the guidance, I am adding headings/links where appropriate.
Thank you in advance for your feedback.
Katie Frederick
From: glen walker
Date: Tue, Apr 07 2020 2:56PM
Subject: Re: Transcript question
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There's good info on transcripts at
https://www.w3.org/WAI/media/av/transcripts/
There's a note about automatic captioning on the previous webpage at
https://www.w3.org/WAI/media/av/captions/#automatic-captions-are-not-sufficient
In general, you want exactly what is spoken, who the speak is (if known)
and when a change of speakers occurs.
If the recording is a meeting that has a q&a session, you'd want to record
the question (perhaps noting that it's from an attendee since you probably
don't have a name) and then who answers the question.
Having other indicators in the transcript/captions is helpful such as
"[applause]", "[laughter]", "[music]".
On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 2:20 PM = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Good Afternoon,
>
> I have an auto-generated caption file I'm working with to generate a
> transcript. I've found and read the WCAG guidance, but am wondering how
> much editing is appropriate for the transcript from the auto-generated
> caption file? When I say editing I'm talking about things like speech
> patterns, punctuation, etc. Per the guidance, I am adding headings/links
> where appropriate.
>
> Thank you in advance for your feedback.
>
> Katie Frederick
> > > > >
From: Kathryn.Frederick@ood.ohio.gov
Date: Tue, Apr 07 2020 3:06PM
Subject: Re: Transcript question
← Previous message | Next message →
Glen,
Thank you for the links. Since I'm working with an automatic caption file, I'm hopeful to find some guidance on punctuation. There are a lot of repeated words that I'm fighting with Microsoft Word about and some other sentence/grammatical stuff, but again, not sure how much of that kind of thing, if any, is mine to edit/correct. Again, thanks for the link resources.
Katie Frederick
-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of glen walker
Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2020 4:57 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Transcript question
There's good info on transcripts at
https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2Fmedia%2Fav%2Ftranscripts%2F&data=02%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=kzkmiF1McJiesInbelEST0mPkjlDNzygZdOeqtq0%2Fng%3D&reserved=0
There's a note about automatic captioning on the previous webpage at
https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2Fmedia%2Fav%2Fcaptions%2F%23automatic-captions-are-not-sufficient&data=02%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=puN0Tu4uEtNj93aUxaFdissHp2X3vIVYH6deoYVtbgA%3D&reserved=0
In general, you want exactly what is spoken, who the speak is (if known) and when a change of speakers occurs.
If the recording is a meeting that has a q&a session, you'd want to record the question (perhaps noting that it's from an attendee since you probably don't have a name) and then who answers the question.
Having other indicators in the transcript/captions is helpful such as "[applause]", "[laughter]", "[music]".
On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 2:20 PM = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Good Afternoon,
>
> I have an auto-generated caption file I'm working with to generate a
> transcript. I've found and read the WCAG guidance, but am wondering
> how much editing is appropriate for the transcript from the
> auto-generated caption file? When I say editing I'm talking about
> things like speech patterns, punctuation, etc. Per the guidance, I am
> adding headings/links where appropriate.
>
> Thank you in advance for your feedback.
>
> Katie Frederick
> > > https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flist.
> webaim.org%2F&data=02%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbf
> e85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%
> 7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=kbwVi3ldHvo%2Fojb22DZOMfzX%2BJk8vi%
> 2FaBowYas31miw%3D&reserved=0 List archives at
> https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwebai
> m.org%2Fdiscussion%2Farchives&data=02%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40o
> od.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb3
> 6ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=paCNVRcH7ZbDcnp5lwY
> C5vco%2FnEKg%2F4Gn2DTvKIELJ0%3D&reserved=0
> >
CAUTION: This is an external email and may not be safe. If the email looks suspicious, please do not click links or open attachments and forward the email to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > or click the Phish Alert Button if available.
From: Patrick H. Lauke
Date: Tue, Apr 07 2020 4:15PM
Subject: Re: Transcript question
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On 07/04/2020 22:06, = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = wrote:
> Glen,
>
> Thank you for the links. Since I'm working with an automatic caption file, I'm hopeful to find some guidance on punctuation. There are a lot of repeated words that I'm fighting with Microsoft Word about and some other sentence/grammatical stuff, but again, not sure how much of that kind of thing, if any, is mine to edit/correct. Again, thanks for the link resources.
There's no hard requirement in terms of WCAG prescribing how much/little
editing you're supposed to do. Nominally, all that is required is a
transcript, and there's an implied ask that it be accurate enough to
convey the same information as the audio/sound/on-screen actions
(because note that a transcript, as opposed to captions, needs to convey
both the audio and and any relevant visual information). Beyond that
(and into the realm of best practice, rather than pure WCAG compliance),
it's up to you how much/little editing you do. As long as you don't
drastically change the meaning, a bit of editing is probably appropriate
(removing filler/pause words), but I'd stay away from outright
rephrasing/paraphrasing things.
P
--
Patrick H. Lauke
https://www.splintered.co.uk/ | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
https://flickr.com/photos/redux/ | https://www.deviantart.com/redux
twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
From: Melinda Godfrey
Date: Tue, Apr 07 2020 8:31PM
Subject: Re: Transcript question
← Previous message | Next message →
Please stop emailing me. Thanks
> On Apr 7, 2020, at 5:06 PM, " = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = " < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Glen,
>
> Thank you for the links. Since I'm working with an automatic caption file, I'm hopeful to find some guidance on punctuation. There are a lot of repeated words that I'm fighting with Microsoft Word about and some other sentence/grammatical stuff, but again, not sure how much of that kind of thing, if any, is mine to edit/correct. Again, thanks for the link resources.
>
> Katie Frederick
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of glen walker
> Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2020 4:57 PM
> To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Transcript question
>
> There's good info on transcripts at
> https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2Fmedia%2Fav%2Ftranscripts%2F&data%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=kzkmiF1McJiesInbelEST0mPkjlDNzygZdOeqtq0%2Fng%3D&reserved=0
>
> There's a note about automatic captioning on the previous webpage at
> https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2Fmedia%2Fav%2Fcaptions%2F%23automatic-captions-are-not-sufficient&data%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=puN0Tu4uEtNj93aUxaFdissHp2X3vIVYH6deoYVtbgA%3D&reserved=0
>
> In general, you want exactly what is spoken, who the speak is (if known) and when a change of speakers occurs.
> If the recording is a meeting that has a q&a session, you'd want to record the question (perhaps noting that it's from an attendee since you probably don't have a name) and then who answers the question.
>
> Having other indicators in the transcript/captions is helpful such as "[applause]", "[laughter]", "[music]".
>
>> On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 2:20 PM = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>
>> Good Afternoon,
>>
>> I have an auto-generated caption file I'm working with to generate a
>> transcript. I've found and read the WCAG guidance, but am wondering
>> how much editing is appropriate for the transcript from the
>> auto-generated caption file? When I say editing I'm talking about
>> things like speech patterns, punctuation, etc. Per the guidance, I am
>> adding headings/links where appropriate.
>>
>> Thank you in advance for your feedback.
>>
>> Katie Frederick
>> >> >> https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flist.
>> webaim.org%2F&data%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbf
>> e85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%
>> 7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=kbwVi3ldHvo%2Fojb22DZOMfzX%2BJk8vi%
>> 2FaBowYas31miw%3D&reserved=0 List archives at
>> https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwebai
>> m.org%2Fdiscussion%2Farchives&data%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40o
>> od.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb3
>> 6ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=paCNVRcH7ZbDcnp5lwY
>> C5vco%2FnEKg%2F4Gn2DTvKIELJ0%3D&reserved=0
>> >>
> > > > >
>
>
>
> CAUTION: This is an external email and may not be safe. If the email looks suspicious, please do not click links or open attachments and forward the email to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > or click the Phish Alert Button if available.
>
>
>
>
> > > >
From: Mallory
Date: Wed, Apr 08 2020 6:12AM
Subject: Re: Transcript question
← Previous message | Next message →
Hm. One thing I'd want to point out is, hearing people listening to someone hem and haw and speaking with lots of dysfluency will filter a lot of that out mentally, to the point that asking the same hearing person to write transcripts/captions for it are often surprised how bad it is.
We don't know that people reading text can do this as easily. I know if *I'm* reading it, I have a lot of trouble with too much dysfluency. I don't write transcripts or captions professionally, so take what I say with a grain of salt, but I tend to include things like cut-off sentences and longer pauses with "uhh..." but I don't include all of them. Some people literally speak like this:
Interviewee: "So, uh, as I was, uh, I was saying that, you know... well, you saw what, um, Mr Soandso stated, and... well, and so that's just... We need to be careful about statements like that, you know? Because it's, uh, it can be very serious and people need to take these things very se-- This is, this is, can be a matter of life and death, you know? And we just need to be, uh... need to be careful of that. These things. And just--"
Interviewer: "So then what about..." (had spoken at exactly the same time as the last two sentences...)
The above can be very difficult to read. And these would mostly not be added to live captioning unless the speaker was being very slow and taking a lot of time. I tend to turn the thing above into something more like
Interviewee: "So, as I was saying... You saw what Mr Soandso stated, and that's just... We need to be careful about statements like that, you know? Because it can be very serious and people need to take these things very se-- This can be a matter of life and death, you know? And we just need to be careful of that. [Of] these things. And just--"
Interviewer [interjecting over the last two sentences]: "So then what about..."
Especially if the intonation of the speaker makes it clearer (or not) about what one sentence versus another is referring to, I'll even add in edits in brackets. That might be against transcripting rules but I've seen it my whole life in written interviews in newspapers and magazines and if I'm not told otherwise I may add them.
I did a quick transcript of a guy being interviewed by Rachel Maddow because I wanted to retweet the clip (which first had no captions, then later really crappy live captions which lost a lot of text because the guy talked a mile a minute). At some point the interviewee did this big sigh with raised shoulders, and I added that as well because it wasn't a dysfluency. He was making a point with it. Sometimes signs people make with their hands or face, I'll add within the square brackets as well, because the transcript might be read by someone who can't see the video.
cheers,
Mallory
> On Apr 7, 2020, at 5:06 PM, " = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = " < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Glen,
>
> Thank you for the links. Since I'm working with an automatic caption file, I'm hopeful to find some guidance on punctuation. There are a lot of repeated words that I'm fighting with Microsoft Word about and some other sentence/grammatical stuff, but again, not sure how much of that kind of thing, if any, is mine to edit/correct. Again, thanks for the link resources.
>
> Katie Frederick
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of glen walker
> Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2020 4:57 PM
> To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Transcript question
>
> There's good info on transcripts at
> https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2Fmedia%2Fav%2Ftranscripts%2F&data%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=kzkmiF1McJiesInbelEST0mPkjlDNzygZdOeqtq0%2Fng%3D&reserved=0
>
> There's a note about automatic captioning on the previous webpage at
> https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2Fmedia%2Fav%2Fcaptions%2F%23automatic-captions-are-not-sufficient&data%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7Cbfe85af68ad548cdd07208d7db36462a%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218898459649268&sdata=puN0Tu4uEtNj93aUxaFdissHp2X3vIVYH6deoYVtbgA%3D&reserved=0
>
> In general, you want exactly what is spoken, who the speak is (if known) and when a change of speakers occurs.
> If the recording is a meeting that has a q&a session, you'd want to record the question (perhaps noting that it's from an attendee since you probably don't have a name) and then who answers the question.
>
> Having other indicators in the transcript/captions is helpful such as "[applause]", "[laughter]", "[music]".
From: Kathryn.Frederick@ood.ohio.gov
Date: Wed, Apr 08 2020 6:31AM
Subject: Re: Transcript question
← Previous message | Next message →
Patrick,
Thank you for your perspective. You answered my question very well. My editing is more cleaning up the auto-generated errors and adding headings where appropriate, things like that. Thanks for your input.
Katie Frederick
Program Administrator
Bureau of Services for the Visually Impaired
Opportunities for Ohioans with Disabilities
Desk: (614) 438-1260
Mobile: (614) 980-2769
Email: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of Patrick H. Lauke
Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2020 6:16 PM
To: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Transcript question
On 07/04/2020 22:06, = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = wrote:
> Glen,
>
> Thank you for the links. Since I'm working with an automatic caption file, I'm hopeful to find some guidance on punctuation. There are a lot of repeated words that I'm fighting with Microsoft Word about and some other sentence/grammatical stuff, but again, not sure how much of that kind of thing, if any, is mine to edit/correct. Again, thanks for the link resources.
There's no hard requirement in terms of WCAG prescribing how much/little editing you're supposed to do. Nominally, all that is required is a transcript, and there's an implied ask that it be accurate enough to convey the same information as the audio/sound/on-screen actions (because note that a transcript, as opposed to captions, needs to convey both the audio and and any relevant visual information). Beyond that (and into the realm of best practice, rather than pure WCAG compliance), it's up to you how much/little editing you do. As long as you don't drastically change the meaning, a bit of editing is probably appropriate (removing filler/pause words), but I'd stay away from outright rephrasing/paraphrasing things.
P
--
Patrick H. Lauke
https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.splintered.co.uk%2F&data=02%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7C195dc3c4169c4204118708d7db41440e%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218945674122112&sdata=uUZz4N7sBiQPnjEveW0MUOfl%2Fhy%2Bj2mDjWer5QF38Rc%3D&reserved=0 | https://gcc01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fpatrickhlauke&data=02%7C01%7Ckathryn.frederick%40ood.ohio.gov%7C195dc3c4169c4204118708d7db41440e%7C50f8fcc494d84f0784eb36ed57c7c8a2%7C0%7C0%7C637218945674122112&sdata=6tkJ1hw9v5%2BSIEe3nSrutmOaozrPAVxDo0CewF1u96M%3D&reserved=0
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twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke CAUTION: This is an external email and may not be safe. If the email looks suspicious, please do not click links or open attachments and forward the email to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = <mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > or click the Phish Alert Button if available.
From: Colleen Gratzer
Date: Thu, Apr 09 2020 11:52AM
Subject: Re: Transcript question
← Previous message | No next message
I agree, Mallory. Reading all the "uh's" and so forth is harder for me
to understand too.
I use an approach similar to what you mentioned.
Colleen Gratzer
Certified Branding Expert + Accessibility Specialist, Gratzer Graphics LLC
https://gratzergraphics.com
Design Mentor and Host of the Design Domination podcast
http://creative-boost.com
On 4/8/20 8:12 AM, Mallory wrote:
> We don't know that people reading text can do this as easily.
I know if *I'm* reading it, I have a lot of trouble with too much
dysfluency.