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Number of posts in this thread: 7 (In chronological order)

From: Gijs Veyfeyken
Date: Thu, Jul 07 2016 5:13AM
Subject: PDF line breaks and reading flow with screenreaders
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Hi,

Screenreaders (NVDA, Jaws) add a stop after every visual line of text in a properly tagged PDF.
In InDesign, the width of the text frame determines the visual width of the lines and therefore the breaks.
But semantically (tag-wise), it's one paragraph. The stops are confusing and break the flow while reading.
Is there anyway to avoid this as an author of a PDF in InDesign? Or is this up to the screenreader, should I file a bug of feature request?

Thanks,

Gijs

---
Gijs Veyfeyken
AnySurfer - towards an accessible internet
http://www.anysurfer.be/en
Brussels - Belgium

From: Karlen Communications
Date: Thu, Jul 07 2016 5:42AM
Subject: Re: PDF line breaks and reading flow with screen readers
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If all the lines of a paragraph are contained within one <P> or Paragraph Tag, the content is read as a single paragraph with no pauses at the end of each line. You only get the normal pauses at the end of each sentence. I use a screen reader and if the paragraph is tagged correctly as I've indicated, there is no pause at the end of the visual line break. You only get that pause if the paragraph has each line individually tagged as a <P> Tag.

This needs to be remediated so that all of the lines of the paragraph are moved under one <P> or Paragraph Tag.

So it is not the screen readers, it is the way the document has been tagged.

Cheers, Karen

From: Olaf Drümmer
Date: Thu, Jul 07 2016 6:13AM
Subject: Re: PDF line breaks and reading flow with screenreaders
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Hi Gijs,

despite the fact that I am not extremely knowledgeable when it comes to screen readers I do know from my use of NVDA that it is not true it has to stop at the end of every line.

Regardless: there is nothing in a properly tagged PDF that indicates to screen readers - or any assistive technology for that matter - to stop at the end of every line. So if anything needs fixing, it looks like the fixing has to happen on the side of the screen reader that is showing this behavior. That much said, I also do know that a lot of the behavior of screen readers goes back to how they are configured. It might be possible to configure at least some of the screen readers such that they do not stop at the end of lines.

Olaf


> On 07.07.2016, at 13:13, Gijs Veyfeyken < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Screenreaders (NVDA, Jaws) add a stop after every visual line of text in a properly tagged PDF.
> In InDesign, the width of the text frame determines the visual width of the lines and therefore the breaks.
> But semantically (tag-wise), it's one paragraph. The stops are confusing and break the flow while reading.
> Is there anyway to avoid this as an author of a PDF in InDesign? Or is this up to the screenreader, should I file a bug of feature request?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gijs
>
> ---
> Gijs Veyfeyken
> AnySurfer - towards an accessible internet
> http://www.anysurfer.be/en
> Brussels - Belgium
> > > >

From: Karlen Communications
Date: Thu, Jul 07 2016 6:32AM
Subject: Re: PDF line breaks and reading flow with screen readers
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I suspect this is a mistagged PDF. The only time I get the pauses at the end of lines in a paragraph are when each line is tagged as a separate paragraph. The screen reader or TTS tools think it is a paragraph and pause accordingly.

Cheers, Karen

From: Marc Solomon
Date: Thu, Jul 07 2016 7:03AM
Subject: Re: PDF line breaks and reading flow with screenreaders
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Gijs,
Can you clarify what technique you are using to read the PDF? For example, are you using the Say All/Read to End hotkey? Or, are you using the Up and Down Arrow keys?
Best,
Marc

From: Moore,Michael (Accessibility) (HHSC)
Date: Thu, Jul 07 2016 7:50AM
Subject: Re: PDF line breaks and reading flow with screen readers
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Be sure that you are navigating by paragraph (JAWS p key) not by line (down arrow). If you are navigating by line the screen reader does what it is told - it reads a line.

Mike Moore
Accessibility Coordinator
Texas Health and Human Services Commission
Civil Rights Office
(512) 438-3431 (Office)

From: Chagnon | PubCom
Date: Thu, Jul 07 2016 8:08AM
Subject: Re: PDF line breaks and reading flow with screen readers
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Gijs,
I'm suspecting that the PDF was exported from an incorrectly made InDesign layout.

Are you able to see or hear the actual tags in the PDF's tag tree and identify whether or not there is a P tag for every line, rather than for every paragraph? As others have said, each paragraph should be in one P tag for screen readers to voice it correctly.

If you can't determine this, feel free to forward the PDF to me at = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = . My firm specializes in accessible documents and we are particularly InDesign and Acrobat experts. Personally, I'd like to know what caused this behavior in the PDF!

--Bevi Chagnon

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