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Thread: fractions and other math bits

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Number of posts in this thread: 5 (In chronological order)

From: Mike Warner
Date: Fri, Jul 29 2016 8:03AM
Subject: fractions and other math bits
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Hi all,

I searched the archives, and the latest discussion on this topic was two
years ago. What's the current best method for accessible math on web
pages? I looked at MathML and MathJax, but that didn't work so well with
NVDA. The demo page that I looked at is:
https://cdn.mathjax.org/mathjax/latest/test/sample-mml.html

What is everyone on this list using for math these days?

Thank you,
Mike

Mike Warner
Director of IT Services
MindEdge, Inc.

From: steve.noble@louisville.edu
Date: Fri, Jul 29 2016 8:30AM
Subject: Re: fractions and other math bits
← Previous message | Next message →

NVDA handles MathML very well (either HTML+MathML or HTML+MathJax)...just make sure you have MathPlayer installed (https://www.dessci.com/en/products/mathplayer/). You'll probably find the best experience with FireFox. You can use IE11 if you use Enterprise Mode. The latest version of JAWS also now supports math in both IE and Firefox. If you want to use Chrome, then you are stuck using the ChromeVox reader, and it will only work with HTML+MathJax pages.

A nice resource for figuring out what works with what is Benetech's Math Support Finder: http://msf.mathmlcloud.org/
It isn't fully populated yet (it is a volunteer effort), but it is growing over time.

Best regards,


--Steve Noble
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
502-969-3088
http://louisville.academia.edu/SteveNoble


From: WebAIM-Forum [ = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] on behalf of Mike Warner [ = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 10:03 AM
To: WebAIM Discussion List
Subject: [WebAIM] fractions and other math bits

Hi all,

I searched the archives, and the latest discussion on this topic was two
years ago. What's the current best method for accessible math on web
pages? I looked at MathML and MathJax, but that didn't work so well with
NVDA. The demo page that I looked at is:
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__cdn.mathjax.org_mathjax_latest_test_sample-2Dmml.html&d=AwIGaQ&c=SgMrq23dbjbGX6e0ZsSHgEZX6A4IAf1SO3AJ2bNrHlk&r=4WMck1ZVLo4tV0IVllcBNKXCSGU6lUERtx_4HD4DqmE&m=aj2dOE2t-n46UvuP_e_baUJUHMm011BvP8YPPjV86lc&s=opuABbzNIO5AQcuWHgI2GkbMMQSVY5NaVGvkfcMvayk&e
What is everyone on this list using for math these days?

Thank you,
Mike

Mike Warner
Director of IT Services
MindEdge, Inc.

From: Mike Warner
Date: Fri, Jul 29 2016 12:17PM
Subject: Re: fractions and other math bits
← Previous message | Next message →

Thanks, Steve. I'd seen several sites talk about mathplayer. Is that
commonly installed? Do you think that students who plan to take an online
math course would know to install it? I could add a screen-reader-only
aria alert div with the download info if it's not installed, if the general
consensus is that mathml/mathplayer is the best way to go.

Thanks,
Mike

Mike Warner
Director of IT Services
MindEdge, Inc.

------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2016 14:30:36 +0000
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] fractions and other math bits
> Message-ID: <C1BF3DDBA47A024DAD5CAFB0A4D8D72001575DBA6F@exmbx01>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> NVDA handles MathML very well (either HTML+MathML or HTML+MathJax)...just
> make sure you have MathPlayer installed (
> https://www.dessci.com/en/products/mathplayer/). You'll probably find the
> best experience with FireFox. You can use IE11 if you use Enterprise Mode.
> The latest version of JAWS also now supports math in both IE and Firefox.
> If you want to use Chrome, then you are stuck using the ChromeVox reader,
> and it will only work with HTML+MathJax pages.
>
> A nice resource for figuring out what works with what is Benetech's Math
> Support Finder: http://msf.mathmlcloud.org/
> It isn't fully populated yet (it is a volunteer effort), but it is growing
> over time.
>
> Best regards,
>
>
> --Steve Noble
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> 502-969-3088
> http://louisville.academia.edu/SteveNoble
>

From: Jonathan Cohn
Date: Fri, Jul 29 2016 1:08PM
Subject: Re: fractions and other math bits
← Previous message | Next message →

MathPlayer is what JAWS uses internally for its braille and speech support of MathML. It is quite possible that the MATHML support in VoiceOver somehow is using MathPlayer libraries, though unlike in JAWS, MathPlayer certainly does not appear as a separate window.

I believe I saw mention of a different project talked about in the 2016 CSUN conference using JavaScript and node.js to communicate math with NVDA.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jul 29, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Mike Warner < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Thanks, Steve. I'd seen several sites talk about mathplayer. Is that
> commonly installed? Do you think that students who plan to take an online
> math course would know to install it? I could add a screen-reader-only
> aria alert div with the download info if it's not installed, if the general
> consensus is that mathml/mathplayer is the best way to go.
>
> Thanks,
> Mike
>
> Mike Warner
> Director of IT Services
> MindEdge, Inc.
>
> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2016 14:30:36 +0000
>> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
>> To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
>> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] fractions and other math bits
>> Message-ID: <C1BF3DDBA47A024DAD5CAFB0A4D8D72001575DBA6F@exmbx01>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> NVDA handles MathML very well (either HTML+MathML or HTML+MathJax)...just
>> make sure you have MathPlayer installed (
>> https://www.dessci.com/en/products/mathplayer/). You'll probably find the
>> best experience with FireFox. You can use IE11 if you use Enterprise Mode.
>> The latest version of JAWS also now supports math in both IE and Firefox.
>> If you want to use Chrome, then you are stuck using the ChromeVox reader,
>> and it will only work with HTML+MathJax pages.
>>
>> A nice resource for figuring out what works with what is Benetech's Math
>> Support Finder: http://msf.mathmlcloud.org/
>> It isn't fully populated yet (it is a volunteer effort), but it is growing
>> over time.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>>
>> --Steve Noble
>> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
>> 502-969-3088
>> http://louisville.academia.edu/SteveNoble
>>
> > > >

From: steve.noble@louisville.edu
Date: Fri, Jul 29 2016 1:21PM
Subject: Re: fractions and other math bits
← Previous message | No next message

MathPlayer has been widely used over the last decade, though I suspect its usage is changing. For a while it was widely used in the mainstream to make up for the fact that Internet Explorer had no native ability to display MathML. That has rather changed lately, since almost all MathML on the web is being served via MathJax, so browsers no longer need to have native support and people do not need to install plugins to simply see the math on the page. Now, MathPlayer's primary function is to augment accessibility to mathematics. Although several AT product depend upon MathPlayer to access math, it rarely comes packaged with the AT...I think Kurzweil 3000 still ships with MathPlayer, but that's probably the exception. Someone using NVDA or WindowEyes, for example, will have to separately download and install MathPlayer (which is free), however, if they want to read math content. It isn't needed, though, if someone is using VoiceOver, ChromeVox, or JAWS 16+.

I wish mathematics content was more widely and uniformly supported by browsers and AT, but for now it is a bit of a "patchwork quilt," so to speak.

Hope that helps...


--Steve Noble
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
502-969-3088
http://louisville.academia.edu/SteveNoble


From: WebAIM-Forum [ = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] on behalf of Mike Warner [ = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 2:17 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] fractions and other math bits

Thanks, Steve. I'd seen several sites talk about mathplayer. Is that
commonly installed? Do you think that students who plan to take an online
math course would know to install it? I could add a screen-reader-only
aria alert div with the download info if it's not installed, if the general
consensus is that mathml/mathplayer is the best way to go.

Thanks,
Mike

Mike Warner
Director of IT Services
MindEdge, Inc.

------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2016 14:30:36 +0000
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] fractions and other math bits
> Message-ID: <C1BF3DDBA47A024DAD5CAFB0A4D8D72001575DBA6F@exmbx01>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> NVDA handles MathML very well (either HTML+MathML or HTML+MathJax)...just
> make sure you have MathPlayer installed (
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.dessci.com_en_products_mathplayer_&d=AwIGaQ&c=SgMrq23dbjbGX6e0ZsSHgEZX6A4IAf1SO3AJ2bNrHlk&r=4WMck1ZVLo4tV0IVllcBNKXCSGU6lUERtx_4HD4DqmE&m«LoWMr3ZugLOMD3GOJoM626oTLbeEh1N7oexc1oe68&s=ITD8VDnUI3QnXHfm-_zeKQEA4j-q3Oz3jaCA-n2t2Vk&e= ). You'll probably find the
> best experience with FireFox. You can use IE11 if you use Enterprise Mode.
> The latest version of JAWS also now supports math in both IE and Firefox.
> If you want to use Chrome, then you are stuck using the ChromeVox reader,
> and it will only work with HTML+MathJax pages.
>
> A nice resource for figuring out what works with what is Benetech's Math
> Support Finder: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__msf.mathmlcloud.org_&d=AwIGaQ&c=SgMrq23dbjbGX6e0ZsSHgEZX6A4IAf1SO3AJ2bNrHlk&r=4WMck1ZVLo4tV0IVllcBNKXCSGU6lUERtx_4HD4DqmE&m«LoWMr3ZugLOMD3GOJoM626oTLbeEh1N7oexc1oe68&s=-Fyx-CfULp6iQJZV9D4vehVBoJp_aRcJMubRWp2-kBs&e> It isn't fully populated yet (it is a volunteer effort), but it is growing
> over time.
>
> Best regards,
>
>
> --Steve Noble
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> 502-969-3088
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__louisville.academia.edu_SteveNoble&d=AwIGaQ&c=SgMrq23dbjbGX6e0ZsSHgEZX6A4IAf1SO3AJ2bNrHlk&r=4WMck1ZVLo4tV0IVllcBNKXCSGU6lUERtx_4HD4DqmE&m«LoWMr3ZugLOMD3GOJoM626oTLbeEh1N7oexc1oe68&s=QzZ-1j3F9wEAWSEnzevOnEim1bHBosDUKGPIXlZs47I&e>