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Thread: SC 2.2.2 and Screen Readers

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From: Wolfgang Berndorfer
Date: Fri, May 24 2019 9:36AM
Subject: SC 2.2.2 and Screen Readers
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Hi WCAG freaks,

All the information I get for SC 2.2.2 is about visual issues:

https://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/time-limits-pause.html

*except:*

a) "Common time-based content includes audio ."

b) "It can also cause problems for screen readers."



But which problems for screen readers could be meant? And which audio
content?



Wolfgang

From: Birkir R. Gunnarsson
Date: Fri, May 24 2019 10:12AM
Subject: Re: SC 2.2.2 and Screen Readers
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Hi

The updated content can cause the screen reader to refresh its virtual
copy of the page, so the screen reader focus may randomly jump to the
top of the page, or even just to some random place on the page
whenever the content is updated.
This doesn't happen for all content, it depends on the nature of the
content being updated (is it just text, does it contain focusable
elements?) but when it happens it's a major usability problem for a
screen reader user.
Another is over use of live regions. If you e.g. have content with a
time in it and the time updates every second and you make the content
a live region, the screen reader will keep announcing the timer value
instead of reading the page content, it's like having someone
constantly yelling numbers into your ear.

Same with audio, if audio auto plays and that audio is louder than the
screen reader, you can't hear the screen reader so you can't operate
the page.
If you have NVDA or Jaws installed, try to click a YouTube video with
music and then navigate the page to look at other vidios from the
channel. It's hard to do while the video is playing, and it's also
hard to find the "pause" button (if the video auto plays when the page
loads you are far away from the pause button when the video starts).



On 5/24/19, Wolfgang Berndorfer < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi WCAG freaks,
>
> All the information I get for SC 2.2.2 is about visual issues:
>
> https://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/time-limits-pause.html
>
> *except:*
>
> a) "Common time-based content includes audio ."
>
> b) "It can also cause problems for screen readers."
>
>
>
> But which problems for screen readers could be meant? And which audio
> content?
>
>
>
> Wolfgang
>
> > > > >


--
Work hard. Have fun. Make history.

From: Wolfgang Berndorfer
Date: Fri, May 24 2019 12:48PM
Subject: Re: SC 2.2.2 and Screen Readers
← Previous message | Next message →

Hi Birkir & all,
I work with Fusion, more with Jaws in that then with Zoomtext. And I
experiece the problems you described too often. But are they an issue of
2.2.2?
Aria-live should handle these problems for screen readers. But ARIA isn't
focussed by 2.2.2. By the way: Which SC can be relevant for usage of
aria-live?
So what stays for 2.2.2 and screen readers?
Wolfgang
-----Urspr√ľngliche Nachricht-----
Von: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] Im Auftrag
von Birkir R. Gunnarsson
Gesendet: Freitag, 24. Mai 2019 18:12
An: WebAIM Discussion List
Betreff: Re: [WebAIM] SC 2.2.2 and Screen Readers

Hi

The updated content can cause the screen reader to refresh its virtual
copy of the page, so the screen reader focus may randomly jump to the
top of the page, or even just to some random place on the page
whenever the content is updated.
This doesn't happen for all content, it depends on the nature of the
content being updated (is it just text, does it contain focusable
elements?) but when it happens it's a major usability problem for a
screen reader user.
Another is over use of live regions. If you e.g. have content with a
time in it and the time updates every second and you make the content
a live region, the screen reader will keep announcing the timer value
instead of reading the page content, it's like having someone
constantly yelling numbers into your ear.

Same with audio, if audio auto plays and that audio is louder than the
screen reader, you can't hear the screen reader so you can't operate
the page.
If you have NVDA or Jaws installed, try to click a YouTube video with
music and then navigate the page to look at other vidios from the
channel. It's hard to do while the video is playing, and it's also
hard to find the "pause" button (if the video auto plays when the page
loads you are far away from the pause button when the video starts).



On 5/24/19, Wolfgang Berndorfer < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi WCAG freaks,
>
> All the information I get for SC 2.2.2 is about visual issues:
>
> https://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/time-limits-pause.html
>
> *except:*
>
> a) "Common time-based content includes audio ."
>
> b) "It can also cause problems for screen readers."
>
>
>
> But which problems for screen readers could be meant? And which audio
> content?
>
>
>
> Wolfgang
>
> > > > >


--
Work hard. Have fun. Make history.

From: Patrick H. Lauke
Date: Fri, May 24 2019 1:34PM
Subject: Re: SC 2.2.2 and Screen Readers
← Previous message | No next message

On 24/05/2019 19:48, Wolfgang Berndorfer wrote:
> Hi Birkir & all,
> I work with Fusion, more with Jaws in that then with Zoomtext. And I
> experiece the problems you described too often. But are they an issue of
> 2.2.2?

The point of the SC is to avoid distractions for users. Pages that have
things like autoplaying videos with audio, or text content areas that
update frequently and do use aria-live, will end up distracting users
(including AT/screenreader users), so need a way to pause/stop/hide
(suppress) these kind of distractions (being able to pause the video or
audio or whatever playing in the background, being able to pause
updating /announcements of those live regions)

> Aria-live should handle these problems for screen readers. But ARIA isn't
> focussed by 2.2.2.

The technology is irrelevant, it's about any forms of distractions.
Whether it's a section of the page designated as a live region, which
gets constant updates pumped into it leading to constant announcements
by AT, or videos/audio snippets that keep getting fired...the important
thing is that this SC targets the end result of things
happening/updating visible/audibly that can distract users.

> By the way: Which SC can be relevant for usage of
> aria-live?

In what way relevant? For things like "it should announce this, but is
NOT a live region so AT won't announce it"? In that case, if it's a
visual status message (like a toast notification or similar), then not
announcing it is a failure of the new SC 4.1.3 Status Messages. If it's
not specifically about an actual visible status message, but more about
"something happens on the screen (e.g. a whole chunk of content got
updated, but it's not appropriate to move focus to it, so it should be
announced using aria-live but it isn't"), then arguably a failure under
4.1.2 as a state change is not announced (this aspect is still a bit
vague in WCAG 2.1)

P
--
Patrick H. Lauke

www.splintered.co.uk | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
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