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Re: Alt text in Word 2016: Indicate null image & which box to type in

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From: JP Jamous
Date: Jan 23, 2017 7:54AM


Although JAWS has always been my primary SR since 1998, I hate some of the junk that were added to it. I keep filing suggestions with VFO with various apps. They tend to be leaning more towards verbose output rather than making that an option. A prime example if you have a fieldset with a legend. I really don't want to hear the legend whenever I move through each radio button. If the purpose is to apply to a certain type of audience with cognitive disabilities, I welcome that. However, allow me to control this through the settings.

The above concept applies to Outlook 2016 calendar, which I filed a bug with them last week about. I keep hoping that someday we can get those manufacturers to ensure their screen readers read similarly. I hope to have it done in my lifetime, but it may not happen.

-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of Moore,Michael (Accessibility) (HHSC)
Sent: Monday, January 23, 2017 8:47 AM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Alt text in Word 2016: Indicate null image & which box to type in

We have had a saying around our offices for a while - JAWS installations are like snowflakes...

Mike Moore
EIR (Electronic Information Resources) Accessibility Coordinator Texas Health and Human Services Commission Civil Rights Office
(512) 438-3431 (Office)

Making electronic information and services accessible to people with disabilities is everyone's job. I am here to help.

-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of Jonathan Avila
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2017 9:13 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Alt text in Word 2016: Indicate null image & which box to type in

> The behavior that I get with Word 2013 and JAWS 17, admittedly a little out of date, is somewhat bizarre.

Mike and others, I re-ran JAWS 17 and 18 and got different results than I previously did with JAWS. Previously the other day JAWS was not announcing the title field of the alt text when using the up/down arrow keys. I re-tested after seeing your results and now it is announcing both. I do wonder if there is some setting in JAWS or change to shared components in JAWS that may affect what is announced as my results have been inconsistent.

I apologize that I can no longer reproduce the results from the other day.

Jonathan

Jonathan Avila
Chief Accessibility Officer
SSB BART Group
<EMAIL REMOVED>
703.637.8957 (Office)

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The information contained in this transmission may be attorney privileged and/or confidential information intended for the use of the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.


-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of Moore,Michael (Accessibility) (HHSC)
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2017 9:50 AM
To: WebAIM Discussion List
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Alt text in Word 2016: Indicate null image & which box to type in

The behavior that I get with Word 2013 and JAWS 17, admittedly a little out of date, is somewhat bizarre.

My test document has three images. All images are placed in-line with the text

1. Picture with title and description
2. Picture with title only
3. Picture with description only

1. In edit mode reading by line nothing is announced for any of images JAWS just says blank.
2. In edit mode reading by word the title is announced if it is present.
3. In edit mode reading by character the title is announced if present. If only the description is present the description is read and the first word of the description is announced in the voice used for the title.
4. In edit mode reading using say all. Both the title and description are read and JAWS tells you which is the title and an which is the description unless only a description is present. In this case JAWS just reads the description. Also in this mode the title and description are read twice for each image and the size of the image is announced.
5. In quick keys mode reading by paragraph. JAWS will only announce the title and ignores the description. Thus if only a description is present JAWS will announce "blank" for the image.
6. In quick keys mode reading by graphic. JAWS will only announce the description and ignores the title. Thus if only a title is present JAWS will only tell you that a picture is present.

JAWS Keys used for reference:

In edit mode - moving forward through the document Reading by line use the down arrow Reading by word use control+left arrow Reading by character use left arrow Reading say all go to the top of the page control+home then insert+down arrow.

To get to quick keys mode use insert+z
Reading by paragraph use the p key
Reading by graphic use the g key

I am not sure what all of this means in terms of what to recommend a best practice for graphics is word documents. Just that life as a JAWS user can be interesting. If the document is to be converted to PDF or HTML for publication use the description field. This will save you from having to enter the alt text again. If you all collaborating on the document with a screen reader user (JAWS or other) I would ask them how they would prefer the graphics to be labelled.

Mike Moore
EIR (Electronic Information Resources) Accessibility Coordinator Texas Health and Human Services Commission Civil Rights Office
(512) 438-3431 (Office)

Making electronic information and services accessible to people with disabilities is everyone's job. I am here to help.

-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of Jonathan Avila
Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2017 7:21 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Alt text in Word 2016: Indicate null image & which box to type in

> Does that apply to both NVDA and JAWS? I remember a while back that some people were recommending putting the same thing into the title and description, because then it caught all screen readers. Do you think Description is enough to catch almost everyone today?

JAWS and NVDA both use the description field as the alt text for images in MS Word. I can't speak to other word processing products and other screen readers as I have not tested those recently.

Jonathan

Jonathan Avila
Chief Accessibility Officer
SSB BART Group
<EMAIL REMOVED>
703.637.8957 (Office)

Visit us online: Website | Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Blog See you at CSUN in March!


-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of L Snider
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2017 2:29 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Alt text in Word 2016: Indicate null image & which box to type in

Hi Jonathan,

Does that apply to both NVDA and JAWS? I remember a while back that some people were recommending putting the same thing into the title and description, because then it caught all screen readers. Do you think Description is enough to catch almost everyone today?

Cheers

Lisa

On Sun, Jan 15, 2017 at 7:43 PM, Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
wrote:

> > Also, at 45 seconds into this video, it indicates that we should
> > write a
> title in the title and description in the description. But, this is
> different than the instructions on the NCDAE website
>
> The description field is the one that is announced by screen readers.
>
> Jonathan
>
> Jonathan Avila
> Chief Accessibility Officer
> SSB BART Group
> <EMAIL REMOVED>
> 703.637.8957 (Office)
>
>