WebAIM - Web Accessibility In Mind

E-mail List Archives

Re: WCAG and role="presentation"

for

From: Birkir R. Gunnarsson
Date: Aug 23, 2017 10:08AM

I agree with Sailesh in that it is highly dependent on the situation
whether not using the presentation role creates a WCAG 1.3.1 issue.
E.g. if a table can be determined by assistive technologies to be a
layout table (no summary attribute, no caption, no th cells, no cells
with scope) the presentation role is technically redundant.

But if a table uses any of the aforementioned techniques but is coded
for visual layout rather than to present tabular information, not
using the presentation role is a WCAG 1.3.1 violation (as explicitly
mentioned in WCAG Failure technique f43),
http://www.w3.org/TR/2016/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20161007/F43

For instance, a table is sometimes perceived to be sufficient to
associate form field labels with form fields (by coding the label as a
header cell).
This is obviously not true (to us who do accessibility fulltime).

We can fix the label association part of it without destroying the
table markup or we can remap the entire table as a group or a form
through ARIA, but regardless of the approach we use, a data table
should not be used to mark up a form.

Incidentally, Sailesh himself wrote one of my favorite articles on
accessible formfield labeling
http://mars.dequecloud.com/demo/form-markup.htm

In most cases using a data structure for layout presents no more than
an annoyance to an assistive technology user, so it is not a high
priority issue (although we can usually wield WCAG failure technique
F43 if needed).
The presentation role provides a quick and easy solution to address
that situation, and there is no reason why it shouldn't be used (if
used responsibly).

But there is always a chance that the use of semantic elements for
layout hides a more fundamental issue or misunderstanding that we have
to be mindful of.



On 8/23/17, Sailesh Panchang < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> Yes but that's a validation issue not within the scope of SC 4.1.1 ...
> just like using scope attribute on a TD. Not good practice from HTML5
> code quality point of view.
> Thanks,
>
> On 8/23/17, Steve Faulkner < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
>> Note: It is a HTML5 conformance error
>>
>> If a table is to be used for layout it must be marked with the attribute
>>> role="presentation" for a user agent to properly represent the table to
>>> an assistive technology and to properly convey the intent of the author
>>> to
>>> tools that wish to extract tabular data from the document.
>>>
>> http://w3c.github.io/html/tabular-data.html#the-table-element
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> SteveF
>> Current Standards Work @W3C
>> <http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-standards-work-at-w3c/>;
>>
>> On 23 August 2017 at 15:37, Sailesh Panchang < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> This does not fail WCAG 2.0 as others before me point out. I term it
>>> as a best practice that enhance user experience for SR users. This was
>>> one of the examples in my CSUN 2016 presentation that attempted to
>>> define the term accessibility best practices.
>>> Best wishes,
>>>
>>> On 8/23/17, Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
>>> >> Let's also keep in mind that using role="presentation" is easy.
>>> >
>>> > While I think we'd all agree that it is best to use role presentation
>>> > --
>>> the
>>> > question is whether it is a violation of WCAG. If table markup is not
>>> used
>>> > with TH, scope or other header association markup then the table is not
>>> > identifying header cells and it can be programmatically determined that
>>> the
>>> > table is a layout table. Since WCAG 2 was written without relying on
>>> ARIA
>>> > and was written before the ARIA spec was finalized -- the supporting
>>> > document seem to indicate that it's not a failure of WCAG as long as
>>> > not
>>> > using role presentation is accessibility supported. However we don't
>>> have
>>> > specific guidance on this and others are likely to disagree.
>>> >
>>> > Ideally these are the types of things that need to be clearly defined
>>> > in
>>> > supporting documents so we can achieve consistency with testing tools
>>> > and
>>> > with conformance evaluations. Questions such as this can be raised
>>> > with
>>> > the Accessibility Guidelines Working Group on Github
>>> > (https://github.com/w3c/wcag/issues). If you feel strongly about
>>> something
>>> > it might be helpful to put together a suggested failure technique --
>>> > although getting failure techniques accepted has been proven difficult.
>>> >
>>> > Jonathan
>>> >
>>> > Jonathan Avila
>>> > Chief Accessibility Officer
>>> > Level Access, inc. (formerly SSB BART Group, inc.)
>>> > (703) 637-8957
>>> > <EMAIL REMOVED>
>>> > Visit us online: Website | Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Blog
>>> > Looking to boost your accessibility knowledge? Check out our free
>>> webinars!
>>> >
>>> > The information contained in this transmission may be attorney
>>> > privileged
>>> > and/or confidential information intended for the use of the individual
>>> > or
>>> > entity named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended
>>> > recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
>>> distribution
>>> > or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.
>>> >
>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>> > From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
>>> Behalf
>>> > Of Birkir R. Gunnarsson
>>> > Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2017 9:28 AM
>>> > To: Lovely, Brian (CONT) < <EMAIL REMOVED> >; WebAIM
>>> Discussion
>>> > List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
>>> > Subject: Re: [WebAIM] WCAG and role="presentation"
>>> >
>>> > Well put Brian.
>>> > Let's also keep in mind that using role="presentation" is easy.
>>> > You add this attribute where appropriate. It does not trigger
>>> > additional
>>> > functionality testing(except with a screen reader) and it does not
>>> > change
>>> > the webpage appearance so you don't have to get designers involved.
>>> >
>>> > And if you are consistently using a semantic element to achieve a
>>> > certain
>>> > appearance (or for other non semantic purposes), you really should take
>>> > a
>>> > look at the design in general (if you have that luxury) to figure out
>>> why.
>>> > It may have other consequences, or break after user agent updates.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On 8/23/17, Lovely, Brian (CONT) via WebAIM-Forum
>>> > < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
>>> >> I would call out a page for a table containing non-tabular data.
>>> >>
>>> >> The role of presentation strips an element of its semantic meaning
>>> >> (essentially converting it to the equivalent of a non-semantic
>>> >> container like a div or span). The semantic meaning of elements is an
>>> >> important part of accessibility, particularly actionable elements. Use
>>> >> of the correct semantic element provides information about the type of
>>> >> information presented, and how the element can be successfully
>>> >> interacted with. I'm not always a "slippery slope" kind of guy, but
>>> >> once you start to erode the trust in the semantic information you
>>> >> present, the user really doesn't know what to expect and must take the
>>> >> extra time and energy to determine if elements are actually what they
>>> >> are presenting themselves to be, and if those elements actually behave
>>> as
>>> >> expected.
>>> >>
>>> >> -----Original Message-----
>>> >> From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
>>> >> Behalf Of Peter Shikli
>>> >> Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 5:33 PM
>>> >> To: WebAIM Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
>>> >> Subject: [WebAIM] WCAG and role="presentation"
>>> >>
>>> >> My question is whether it is a violation to not use
>>> >> role="presentation" on elements which are used for presentation
>>> >> purposes only, such as tables. I realize we should use it for
>>> >> decorative tables, but is it a requirement for a Level AA rating per
>>> >> WCAG Success Guideline 1.3.1 "Info and Relationships"?
>>> >>
>>> >> Understanding WCAG 2.0, http://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/
>>> >> states that when possible, information presented visually should also
>>> >> be made available programmatically. Many examples are given, but I
>>> >> would like some clarification specifically on the use of WAI-ARIA's
>>> >> role="presentation."
>>> >>
>>> >> Sincerely,
>>> >> Peter Shikli
>>> >> <EMAIL REMOVED>
>>> >> 503-570-6831
>>> >> FAX: 213-337-7029
>>> >> Access2online
>>> >> 29030 SW Town Center Loop East
>>> >> Suite 202-187
>>> >> Wilsonville, OR 97070
>>> >> www.Access2online.com
>>> >> Prison inmates helping websites become accessible
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
>>> >> >>> >> >>> >>
>>> >> The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and/or
>>> >> proprietary to Capital One and/or its affiliates and may only be used
>>> >> solely in performance of work or services for Capital One. The
>>> >> information transmitted herewith is intended only for use by the
>>> >> individual or entity to which it is addressed. If the reader of this
>>> >> message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that
>>> >> any review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, copying or
>>> >> other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this
>>> >> information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this
>>> >> communication in error, please contact the sender and delete the
>>> material
>>> >> from your computer.
>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
>>> >> >>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > Work hard. Have fun. Make history.
>>> > >>> > >>> archives at
>>> > http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Sailesh Panchang
>>> Principal Accessibility Consultant
>>> Deque Systems Inc
>>> Phone 703-225-0380 ext 105
>>> Mobile: 571-344-1765
>>> >>> >>> >>> >>>
>> >> >> >> >>
>
>
> --
> Sailesh Panchang
> Principal Accessibility Consultant
> Deque Systems Inc
> Phone 703-225-0380 ext 105
> Mobile: 571-344-1765
> > > > >


--
Work hard. Have fun. Make history.