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Re: Data table, forms vs content mode

for

From: Brandon Keith Biggs
Date: Oct 31, 2017 4:12AM


Hello,

This is probably a bug in NVDA. NVDA should make the chirp for entering in
edit mode.



This is also an UX problem. No blind person would ever want to tab through
a table (yes, screen reader users have a user experience). There should be
WCAG for sighted users, then devs like this can see what a different
interpretations of a standard without UX can feel like.



Table cells don’t have tabindex by default and there is a reason for this.

Thanks,



Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>;

On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:09 PM, Birkir R. Gunnarsson <
<EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:

> Why are all the elements in the table focusable?
> Does activating them with the keyboard (or clicking them with the
> mouse) do something?
>
>
>
> On 10/30/17, KellyFord < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> > Can you expand on this paragraph:
> >
> > The link invokes the javascript getsElementByID and places focus
> accordingly
> > because we must move between this table and an overlay, which is removed
> > here for clarity.
> >
> > What do you mean by move between thee two items? Are you expecting that
> > focus moves outside the table to some overlay?
> >
> > Kelly
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
> Behalf
> > Of Léonie Watson
> > Sent: Monday, October 30, 2017 2:35 PM
> > To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >;
> <EMAIL REMOVED>
> > Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Data table, forms vs content mode
> >
> >
> > On 30/10/2017 18:39, <EMAIL REMOVED> wrote:
> >>
> >> Using NVDA and IE, Chrome and FF I'm able to arrow correctly through
> this
> >> table (code below), in other words move between the individual cells
> with
> >> ctrl-alt-arrow.
> >>
> >> But if I press the link, it places focus within the table but puts us
> into
> >> forms mode (which I don't think is announced). The user thus finds
> >> themselves in a table but unable to move around with the usual
> >> ctl-alt-arrows, which I think is unexpected. Also, the user won't know
> to
> >> ESC, since I don't think they hear they're in forms mode.
> >
> > I can confirm this behaviour in NVDA. The usual "clunk" audio cue is
> given
> > when NVDA switches into forms mode, but I agree that the lack of
> > navigability is unexpected (not to mention inconvenient).
> >>
> >> The link invokes the javascript getsElementByID and places focus
> >> accordingly because we must move between this table and an overlay,
> which
> >> is removed here for clarity.
> >>
> >
> > It seems to be something NVDA is doing in response to having keyboard
> > focused moved using .focus(). The problem doesn't happen if you use the
> tab
> > key to move focus to the table or one of its headers, it only happens
> when
> > the JavaScript link is used.
> >
> > Changing the tabindex on the target header to tabindex="-1" doesn't make
> > any difference, nor does stripping out all other instances of the
> tabindex
> > attribute.
> >
> > The problem exists with NVDA in FF, Chrome, and IE. It isn't exhibited by
> > Jaws in any of those browsers, which suggests the issue may not be with
> > either the browser or the JavaScript.
> >
> >> In forms mode, ctl-alt-arrow behavior on a table seems suspended.
> >
> > Yes it is. This is because in forms mode the screen reader passes all
> > navigation back to the browser (so only basic keyboard commands like tab,
> > enter, space, and up/down/left/right arrows are available).
> >
> >>
> >> Any thoughts or solutions? I would fail this on 1.3.1. The dev says
> >> this is about 2.1.1 and since 2.1.1 says keyboard-only but doesn't
> specify
> >> key combinations, merely being able to tab through the table should be
> >> sufficient. I don't think the user will even know to tab here.
> >>
> >
> > I agree that tabbing through a table is unlikely to occur to screen
> reader
> > users. It can also be argued that making non-interactive content
> tabbable is
> > rarely a good thing. It requires keyboard users who don't use a screen
> > reader to tab a lot to get through/past the table.
> >
> > Léonie.
> >
> > > > > archives at
> > http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
>
>
> --
> Work hard. Have fun. Make history.
> > > > >