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Re: html 5 required

for

From: Beranek, Nicholas
Date: Nov 6, 2017 4:47PM


Hi Diane, I recommend keeping the required attribute. For compatibility, I would add the value “required”, as well. You’re encountering expected behavior with NVDA and Firefox because, by definition, since a value is required, lack of a value, or null value, would be invalid. I am always hesitant to include a hack to appease a browser/AT, and the use of the required attribute is a sufficient technique.

Nick Beranek
Capital One

On Nov 6, 2017, at 5:17 PM, Tomlins Diane < <EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >> wrote:


This just came up for us, and we just switched 70+ code files to use the html 5 "required' attribute. Now we find in testing, using NVDA 2017.3 with Firefox, NVDA announces empty fields as "invalid entry" the first time the user focuses on them, even before the error checking that takes place when a user hits the Submit button. So I would think this would make things confusing for AT users.

We tried adding aria-required="true" but that didn't help since we still have the "required" attribute in there too.

If I understand the replies to this thread, the "required' attribute is still a patchwork of support between browsers and AT??

Our developers won't be thrilled to back-pedal to take out the attribute they just put in :-/

Any possible workaround besides going back?

Thanks!

Diane R Tomlins
HCA IT&S | Digital Media
Accessibility SME


-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of Jonathan Avila
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2017 7:04 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [WebAIM] html 5 required

I am confused. The label is exposed isn´t it, the way you wrote it.

I can confirm that with NVDA after a form is submitted and focus is moved to the field in error in some browsers NVDA only announces the error and not the label. If you open the speech viewer you will find the label is there -- which I believe indicates that the error message is being treated like an assertive live region and somehow interrupting the label from being announced.

In our testing of the HTML required attribute in different browsers the supports varied between browsers with screen readers. In addition, some browsers use a red border to indicate the error state while only providing a mouse involked tooltip further complicated the use of the required attribute as it could be claimed color alone was used to communicate the error visually to people with color deficiency who were not using a screen reader.

I would agree with Patrick that at this time if you need to support multiple browsers and multiple AT the support is not there yet to fully conform with this method alone. It’s a shame because it's a simple method that should be better supported without requiring developers to implement more complex and costly solutions.

Jonathan

Jonathan Avila
Chief Accessibility Officer
Level Access, inc. (formerly SSB BART Group, inc.)
(703) 637-8957
<EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >
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-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On Behalf Of Birkir R. Gunnarsson
Sent: Saturday, August 5, 2017 1:19 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >>
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] html 5 required

I am confused. The label is exposed isn´t it, the way you wrote it.
If there is a title attribute or a placeholder, maybe those don´t get exposed when you add the required attribute?
Which browsers/a.t. combinations are you using?
Are you using a proper label assocaition?
Are you using either a title or placeholder attribute (on the input field)?
Cheers
-B

On 8/3/17, Angela French < <EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >> wrote:
Thanks for responding. I guess what confuses me is that if the cursor
goes to the field (with the required message) and the field is
labelled correctly, why isn't the label exposed again?

Angela

-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
Behalf Of Patrick H. Lauke
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 2:51 PM
To: <EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] html 5 required

On 03/08/2017 22:45, Angela French wrote:
Hello,

We are trying to use the html 5 required attribute on required form
fields. In testing, I am finding that each browser I test with (with
NVDA) handles it differently. The problem is that in most browsers I
hear the message that a field is required, but it doesn't tell me
WHICH field it is referring to even though the cursor goes to the first empty field.
The only browser that played very nicely on this was Chrome.
Curiously, even Chrome didn't read the required field message
("Please fill out this field."). Rather it said "Last Name invalid entry required."

Is there a way to make this behavior consistent?

In short: don't use required attribute at this stage, but instead
aria-required="true" and traditional custom error messages/bubbles.

Regarding the "Please fill out this field", I assume you're referring
to the default browser error tooltip bubble? If so, last time I
checked (2 years ago), none of the browsers exposed the text they
visually present
-
http://developer.telerik.com/featured/building-html5-form-validation-b
ubble-replacements/#comment-2381878676

So once again, better to use old custom-made bubbles to show error
messages (and then tie them to the relevant form field with
aria-describedby or similar).

P
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Patrick H. Lauke

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