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Re: 4.1.1 Parsing > nested elements

for

From: Steve Faulkner
Date: Apr 1, 2018 4:15AM


> That is the nesting structure requirements for 4.1.1 should be based on
the calculated role not the element's tag name.

yes, agreed

--

Regards

SteveF
Current Standards Work @W3C
<http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-standards-work-at-w3c/>;

On 1 April 2018 at 01:18, Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:

> > Use of role=navigation on <ul> is a conformance error
>
> Hi Steve, yes, agreed -- bad choice of example on my part. My
> question/statement was that when an allowed role is applied to an HTML
> element or one of it's children then that applied allowed role alters the
> allowed parent/child elements and allowed roles. Thus the use of the role
> can break the nesting structure role/implied role and in such cases even if
> ARIA is applied to only the parent or the child a 4.1.1 violation can
> occur. That is the nesting structure requirements for 4.1.1 should be
> based on the calculated role not the element's tag name.
>
> Jonathan
>
> Jonathan Avila
> Chief Accessibility Officer
> Level Access
> <EMAIL REMOVED>
> 703.637.8957 office
>
> Visit us online:
> Website | Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Blog
>
> See you at CSUN in March!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WebAIM-Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> > On Behalf Of
> Steve Faulkner
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 5:05 PM
> To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] 4.1.1 Parsing > nested elements
>
> Hi Jon,
> Use of role=navigation on <ul> is a conformance error
> https://www.w3.org/TR/html-aria/#ul
>
> So if you do check your code it will throw an error, for example
> https://validator.w3.org/nu/?doc=https%3A%2F%2Fs.codepen.
> io%2Fstevef%2Fdebug%2FjzYgdJ
>
>
>
> --
>
> Regards
>
> SteveF
> Current Standards Work @W3C
> <http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-standards-work-at-w3c/>;
>
> On 30 March 2018 at 03:56, Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> wrote:
>
> > > "elements are nested according to their specifications"
> >
> > While ARIA isn't specifically called out by this SC and it's not a
> > markup language I personally consider that when ARIA roles are applied
> > to elements then descendant elements roles either explicit or implied
> should follow as
> > well. For example, if you change an UL to role navigation then the you
> > can't have dangling LI elements without a role like presentation or
> > something else. In my example role navigation shouldn't be applied to
> > UL it should be applied to a div above the UL.
> >
> > Is this your opinion as well?
> >
> > Jonathan
> >
> > Jonathan Avila
> > Chief Accessibility Officer
> > Level Access
> > <EMAIL REMOVED>
> > 703.637.8957 office
> >
> > Visit us online:
> > Website | Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Blog
> >
> > See you at CSUN in March!
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: WebAIM-Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> > On Behalf Of
> > Steve Faulkner
> > Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 7:04 AM
> > To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> > Subject: Re: [WebAIM] 4.1.1 Parsing > nested elements
> >
> > The criterion itself is normative and states:
> > "elements are nested according to their specifications"
> > https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20/#ensure-compat-parses
> >
> > If there is a nesting error found when conformance checking the HTML
> > then from a strict reading it is a failure, it does not need an
> > informative technique to state that.
> >
> > But at the same time only a subset of nesting issues will cause
> > accessibility problems, a <div> inside a <span>, for example, is not
> > an issue that I consider a blocker.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > SteveF
> > Current Standards Work @W3C
> > <http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-standards-work-at-w
> > 3c/>
> >
> > On 29 March 2018 at 11:45, Fernand van Olphen <
> > <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Steve,
> > >
> > > I agree with you that it is a PITA. But I feel that there is a
> > > subtle difference between guidance and instruction.
> > >
> > > I have to have some ammo if I am auditing a website and in my report
> > > I state that SC 4.1.1 is not met because there are incorrect nested
> > elements.
> > >
> > > What if the developer is wcag-savvy, reads my report and slaps me
> > > back in my face, saying: :
> > > Incorrect nested elements? According to the Sufficient Technique
> > > number 4 I do not have to nest elements correctly, because I can
> > > pass the SC by a combination of H74, H93 and H94. So, to hell with
> > > your incorrect nested elements!
> > >
> > > What am I to say to him ? (Besides: you are fired!!!)
> > >
> > > Fernand
> > >
> > > De disclaimer van toepassing op e-mail van de gemeente Den Haag
> > > vindt u
> > > op: http://www.denhaag.nl/disclaimer
> > > > > > > > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > > > >
> > > > > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > > > > > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > >
> > > at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > > > >