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Re: soft hyphens hard coded

for

From: wolfgang.berndorfer@zweiterblick.at
Date: Jan 12, 2021 9:27AM

Hi Mallory
I completely agree to your objections on a triple-A level. (3.1.5 Reading Level and 3.1.6 Pronunciation are AAA)

Seems, ­ won't serve as a sufficient technique for 3.1.6., since it doesn't provide techniques for any reading level.

But would you agree that shy can be helpful for pronunciation too, if it is used with meaning for hyphenation? It would help SR and won't do any harm for easy to read under CSS hyphens: none.

Wolfgang

-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> > On Behalf Of Mallory
Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2021 4:42 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] soft hyphens hard coded

If you want people to know how to pronounce things, you don't hide the hyphen and don't use &shy.

You use a real hyphen, so people with disabilities but no screen readers have equal access. Why should only those with speech synthesisers benefit? And should makers of things like TextHelp or other reading-assistance text-to-speech softwares implement a pause where hyphens are?

cheers,
Mallory

On Tue, Jan 12, 2021, at 4:16 PM, <EMAIL REMOVED> wrote:
> Hi Patrick and all,
>
> If shy is used exclusively for meaningful hyphenation off
> auto-hyphenation, it would also help to realize SC 3.1.6., I'd suppose.
> I don't find a restriction for only *visual* usage of shy here:
> https://unicode.org/reports/tr14/#SoftHyphen
> Do you have any references for not to use shy for aural issues like in
> pronunciation?
>
> It is a hack but is it also a possible mechanism for SC 3.1.6?
> I looked it up and found that shy is not mentioned in the
> understanding-article for 3.1.6:
> https://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/meaning-pronunciation.html
>
> But again, if shy were used exclusively for meaningful hyphenation off
> auto-hyphenation, it would also help to realize 3.1.6., I'd suppose.
> Two flies at once: meaningful visual hyphenation and pronunciation.
>
> Wolfgang
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WebAIM-Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> > On Behalf Of
> Patrick H. Lauke
> Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2021 9:43 AM
> To: <EMAIL REMOVED>
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] soft hyphens hard coded
>
> On 12/01/2021 08:09, <EMAIL REMOVED> wrote:
> > Hyphe‧nation
> > The library for auto-hyphenation in the browser has no exception for
> > the Hyphe-Nation. So, the author must manually code the hyphenation
> > point in
> > HTML:
> > Hyphe&shy;nation
> > The word is correctly wrapped visually and:
> > The word is correctly pronounced by speech synthesizers. (There
> > should be a small pause between *hyphe* and *nation* to hear the difference).
> > I didn't hear any aural problems for that usage. So, the pause is
> > not a bug of synthesizers.
>
> Soft hyphenation characters are not intended to be
> pronounced/announced.
> They're a signal that this is a potential hyphenation point to
> *visually* break the word. Speech synthesizers should not pause, as
> they shouldn't pause for CSS automatic hyphenation.
>
> P
> --
> Patrick H. Lauke
>
> https://www.splintered.co.uk/ | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
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> twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
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> >