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Thread: Skip Navigation
Number of posts in this thread: 13 (In chronological order)
From: Moana Jarvis
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 6:15AM
Subject: Skip Navigation
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When providing a way to skip repetitive navigation links, must the skip
navigation link be the first item on the page so that you are skipping
to cont
From: Tom Gilder
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 7:26AM
Subject: Re: Skip Navigation
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On Monday, July 22, 2002, 2:06:02 PM, you wrote:
> When providing a way to skip repetitive navigation links, must the skip
> navigation link be the first item on the page so that you are skipping
> to content and avoiding pictures, headings, etc. in addition to links;
> or can you place the skip navigation link right before the repetitive
> links?
It really depends on the site - what works for one might not work for another.
Personally I tend to put the skip link just below the main logo on a site, so a
user would come across the site or page's name first, letting the user know what
the content is before they can access it.
Of course, you can always have more than one skip link - and personally I prefer
"skip to content" instead of "skip navigation" - the latter doesn't say *where*
you are skipping to.
--
Tom Gilder
http://tom.me.uk/
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From: John Foliot - bytown internet
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 7:32AM
Subject: RE: Skip Navigation
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MessageThe primary purpose of the"skip nav" link is to allow screen readers
and other devices (cell phones?) to skip over repetitive elements such as
persistant navigation links, etc. IMHO this would also include top banners
(<img src="topbanner.gif" alt="foobar company">) and other persistant
"branding" graphics, especially if this is on every page. As such it (the
skip nav) *probably* should be the first item encountered, but this is a
judgemnet call rather than an absolute - think of the functionality it is
providing.
As always, just MHO
JF
From: Diane Boettcher
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 7:54AM
Subject: Re: Skip Navigation
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--- Tom Gilder < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Personally I tend to put the skip link just below
> the main logo on a site, so a
> user would come across the site or page's name
> first, letting the user know what
> the content is before they can access it.
This is where I put it before seeing a blind user
access a page. JAWS reads the TITLE tag of a page
first, so the page idenfication is heard without
bothering with the logo. Now I use:
body
skip navigational links
Regards, Diane
====Diane Boettcher
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
Help Afgan women at: http://www.rawa.org/
"Losing money is the worst guideline violation of them all."
- Jakob Nielsen
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From: Tom Gilder
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 8:35AM
Subject: Re: Skip Navigation
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On Monday, July 22, 2002, 3:49:15 PM, you wrote:
> > Personally I tend to put the skip link just below
> > the main logo on a site
>
> This is where I put it before seeing a blind user
> access a page. JAWS reads the TITLE tag of a page
> first, so the page idenfication is heard without
> bothering with the logo.
That is true, although presumes all access devices act in the same way as JAWS.
Some users may be viewing through a text browser that does not display the
title, for instance.
--
Tom Gilder
http://tom.me.uk/
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From: Diane Boettcher
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 10:23AM
Subject: Re: Skip Navigation
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--- Tom Gilder < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> On Monday, July 22, 2002, 3:49:15 PM, you wrote:
> > > Personally I tend to put the skip link just
> below
> > > the main logo on a site
> >
> > This is where I put it before seeing a blind user
> > access a page. JAWS reads the TITLE tag of a page
> > first, so the page idenfication is heard without
> > bothering with the logo.
>
> That is true, although presumes all access devices
> act in the same way as JAWS.
>
> Some users may be viewing through a text browser
> that does not display the
> title, for instance.
Good point, however I'm not that concerned about
sighted folks using a text browser being able to skip
links prior to seeing the title. They should see
[skip nav links]
Title
[about]
[news]
[home]
Fairly easy for the Palm VII user to skip to the
content and see the title.
Am I missing a scenario? Perhaps two [skip to
content] links would be better, or are we just getting
cluttered now?
====Diane Boettcher
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
Help Afgan women at: http://www.rawa.org/
"Losing money is the worst guideline violation of them all."
- Jakob Nielsen
__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
http://health.yahoo.com
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From: Jon Gunderson
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 1:44PM
Subject: Re: Skip Navigation
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The skip link strategy is only works on Internet Explorer. It does not
work for Opera and Netscape. So you really need to use multiple techniques
to meet this 508 requirement. I suggest using headers for main topics and
tabindex for the first link past the navigation bar.
Jon
At 03:16 PM 7/22/2002 +0100, you wrote:
>On Monday, July 22, 2002, 2:06:02 PM, you wrote:
> > When providing a way to skip repetitive navigation links, must the skip
> > navigation link be the first item on the page so that you are skipping
> > to content and avoiding pictures, headings, etc. in addition to links;
> > or can you place the skip navigation link right before the repetitive
> > links?
>
>It really depends on the site - what works for one might not work for another.
>
>Personally I tend to put the skip link just below the main logo on a site,
>so a
>user would come across the site or page's name first, letting the user
>know what
>the content is before they can access it.
>
>Of course, you can always have more than one skip link - and personally I
>prefer
>"skip to content" instead of "skip navigation" - the latter doesn't say
>*where*
>you are skipping to.
>
>--
>Tom Gilder
>http://tom.me.uk/
>
>
>----
>To subscribe, unsubscribe, or view list archives,
>visit http://www.webaim.org/discussion/
Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., ATP
Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
Division of Rehabilitation - Education Services
MC-574
College of Applied Life Studies
University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
1207 S. Oak Street, Champaign, IL 61820
Voice: (217) 244-5870
Fax: (217) 333-0248
E-mail: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
WWW: http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~jongund
WWW: http://www.w3.org/wai/ua
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From: John Foliot - bytown internet
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 2:06PM
Subject: RE: Skip Navigation
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I beg your pardon?
Even in crummy old HTML3.2 you could go:
<a href="#content"><img src="spacer.gif" height="1" width="1"></a>
<a name="content>Content here</a>
works in just about everything.....
JF
>
From: Joel Ward
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 2:10PM
Subject: Re: Skip Navigation
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> The skip link strategy is only works on Internet Explorer. It does not
> work for Opera and Netscape. So you really need to use multiple
techniques
> to meet this 508 requirement. I suggest using headers for main topics and
> tabindex for the first link past the navigation bar.
>
Hi Jon,
What method does not work in Netscape/Opera? I thought the page anchor
method worked across all standard browsers?
E.g.
<a href="#content">Skip to content</a>
<!--Navigation goes here-->
<a name="content"></a>
Content
?
Joel
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From: Jim Thatcher
Date: Mon, Jul 22 2002 2:30PM
Subject: RE: Skip Navigation
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Jon, What do you mean the skip link doesn't work with Opera or Netscape? The
skip link idea works just fine there, it is just that there are no assistive
technologies using those browsers to take advantage of the skip link. But
the link is still there.
Jim Thatcher
Accessibility Consulting
http://jimthatcher.com
512-306-0931
From: Jon Gunderson
Date: Tue, Jul 23 2002 7:20AM
Subject: RE: Skip Navigation
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JF,
The graphical view will scroll to the linked item, but not all browsers
move the tab indexing to the first link past the internal link (e.g. the
navigation bar being skipped).
Test page:
http://cita.rehab.uiuc.edu/courses/2002-02-REHAB711NC/sect508/sect508-web.html#main
Opera 6.0 does NOT move the tab index past the navigation bar (but using
the header navigation will, the S and W keys)
Netscape 4.x does NOT move the tab index past the navigation bar
Internet Explorer 6.0 does move the tab index past the navigation bar
Netscape 7.0 does move the tab index past the navigation bar
Jon
At 05:01 PM 7/22/2002 -0400, you wrote:
>I beg your pardon?
>
>Even in crummy old HTML3.2 you could go:
><a href="#content"><img src="spacer.gif" height="1" width="1"></a>
>
><a name="content>Content here</a>
>
>works in just about everything.....
>
>JF
>
>
>
> >
From: Jon Gunderson
Date: Tue, Jul 23 2002 7:30AM
Subject: Re: Skip Navigation
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In addition to the skip navigation bar there are two additional techniques:
1. Use headers (H1-H6) Opera supports header navigation (only major browser
that does) and that will move the tab index past the navigation bar
Test page: http:www.w3.org
2. Use the TABINDEX attribute for links. This determines the tabbing order
of links and form controls. Supported by IE 6 and Netscape 6, but not
Netscape 4.x and Opera 6.0
test page: http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/TS/html401/cp0101/0101-TABINDEX.html
Jon
At 05:05 PM 7/22/2002 -0400, you wrote:
> > The skip link strategy is only works on Internet Explorer. It does not
> > work for Opera and Netscape. So you really need to use multiple
>techniques
> > to meet this 508 requirement. I suggest using headers for main topics and
> > tabindex for the first link past the navigation bar.
> >
>
>Hi Jon,
>
>What method does not work in Netscape/Opera? I thought the page anchor
>method worked across all standard browsers?
>
>E.g.
><a href="#content">Skip to content</a>
><!--Navigation goes here-->
><a name="content"></a>
>Content
>
>?
>
>Joel
>
>
>----
>To subscribe, unsubscribe, or view list archives,
>visit http://www.webaim.org/discussion/
Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., ATP
Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
Division of Rehabilitation - Education Services
MC-574
College of Applied Life Studies
University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
1207 S. Oak Street, Champaign, IL 61820
Voice: (217) 244-5870
Fax: (217) 333-0248
E-mail: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
WWW: http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~jongund
WWW: http://www.w3.org/wai/ua
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From: Jon Gunderson
Date: Tue, Jul 23 2002 7:34AM
Subject: RE: Skip Navigation
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Jim,
The skip link is for more than just assistive technology users, users with
other disabilities would lik to skip navigation bars and while the link
appears it has different behaviors depending on what browser you are
using. Not everyone uses IE.
Jon
At 04:21 PM 7/22/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>Jon, What do you mean the skip link doesn't work with Opera or Netscape? The
>skip link idea works just fine there, it is just that there are no assistive
>technologies using those browsers to take advantage of the skip link. But
>the link is still there.
>
>Jim Thatcher
>Accessibility Consulting
>http://jimthatcher.com
>512-306-0931
>
>