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Number of posts in this thread: 11 (In chronological order)

From: Lynn Holdsworth
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 3:11AM
Subject: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
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Hi all,

I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.

Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
expected behaviour?

Thanks as always, Lynn

From: _mallory
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 5:28AM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
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Hi,
what happens if I entered searchy text and hit tabr+enter? if I didn't
see there wasn't a button, I may overshoot the form.

Unless it fails Understandable, which it well might, this may be more
the realm of so-so usability rather than a direct WCAG violation.

Whether it's expected behaviour is pretty much set by your userbase.

In a not-very-relevant aside, I still use Opera 12 for various keyboardy
reasons. Some sites, like community.sitepoint.com (which does have a
separate submit) give me a CSRF error if I hit enter rather than first
focussing on the submit. I suspect this is due to the hidden input not
being sent along with the login/pass on enter (form submit) which some
browsers have been known to have issue with, while *everything* is sent
on the submit-button-click+submit event.

This might not be an issue with users of non-ancient browsers though.

_mallory


On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:11:28AM +0100, Lynn Holdsworth wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
> textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.
>
> Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
> expected behaviour?
>
> Thanks as always, Lynn
> > > >

From: Birkir R. Gunnarsson
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 5:44AM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | Next message →

How would users of a mobile device submit the form?

On 7/31/15, _mallory < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi,
> what happens if I entered searchy text and hit tabr+enter? if I didn't
> see there wasn't a button, I may overshoot the form.
>
> Unless it fails Understandable, which it well might, this may be more
> the realm of so-so usability rather than a direct WCAG violation.
>
> Whether it's expected behaviour is pretty much set by your userbase.
>
> In a not-very-relevant aside, I still use Opera 12 for various keyboardy
> reasons. Some sites, like community.sitepoint.com (which does have a
> separate submit) give me a CSRF error if I hit enter rather than first
> focussing on the submit. I suspect this is due to the hidden input not
> being sent along with the login/pass on enter (form submit) which some
> browsers have been known to have issue with, while *everything* is sent
> on the submit-button-click+submit event.
>
> This might not be an issue with users of non-ancient browsers though.
>
> _mallory
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:11:28AM +0100, Lynn Holdsworth wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
>> textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.
>>
>> Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
>> expected behaviour?
>>
>> Thanks as always, Lynn
>> >> >> >> > > > > >


--
Work hard. Have fun. Make history.

From: Aaron Cannon
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 9:20AM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | Next message →

Don't most mobile keyboards, on-screen or otherwise, provide an enter key?

Aaron Cannon

On 7/31/15, Birkir R. Gunnarsson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> How would users of a mobile device submit the form?
>
> On 7/31/15, _mallory < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>> Hi,
>> what happens if I entered searchy text and hit tabr+enter? if I didn't
>> see there wasn't a button, I may overshoot the form.
>>
>> Unless it fails Understandable, which it well might, this may be more
>> the realm of so-so usability rather than a direct WCAG violation.
>>
>> Whether it's expected behaviour is pretty much set by your userbase.
>>
>> In a not-very-relevant aside, I still use Opera 12 for various keyboardy
>> reasons. Some sites, like community.sitepoint.com (which does have a
>> separate submit) give me a CSRF error if I hit enter rather than first
>> focussing on the submit. I suspect this is due to the hidden input not
>> being sent along with the login/pass on enter (form submit) which some
>> browsers have been known to have issue with, while *everything* is sent
>> on the submit-button-click+submit event.
>>
>> This might not be an issue with users of non-ancient browsers though.
>>
>> _mallory
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:11:28AM +0100, Lynn Holdsworth wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
>>> textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.
>>>
>>> Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
>>> expected behaviour?
>>>
>>> Thanks as always, Lynn
>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >>
>
>
> --
> Work hard. Have fun. Make history.
> > > > >

From: Birkir R. Gunnarsson
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 11:47AM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | Next message →

Hi

No, your average iPhone virtual keyboard does not have an enter key,
that is what concerns me the most.
Users of mobile devices running Voiceover will be very likely to view
your webpage, how are they to activate the search?
Maybe there is a mechanism already, but it is important to think of
your mobile device users, disabled or otherwise.
That´s why I would tentatively call a 2.1.1 issue on this, and say
that for users of mobile devices there is no way to activate the
search.
If the responsive view of the page already takes care of this I think
I could not call it a WCAG violation, though I would make a usability
note.
I, myself, get confused when I do not have a submit button for forms
that I am filling in.

Cheers


On 7/31/15, Aaron Cannon < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Don't most mobile keyboards, on-screen or otherwise, provide an enter key?
>
> Aaron Cannon
>
> On 7/31/15, Birkir R. Gunnarsson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>> How would users of a mobile device submit the form?
>>
>> On 7/31/15, _mallory < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> what happens if I entered searchy text and hit tabr+enter? if I didn't
>>> see there wasn't a button, I may overshoot the form.
>>>
>>> Unless it fails Understandable, which it well might, this may be more
>>> the realm of so-so usability rather than a direct WCAG violation.
>>>
>>> Whether it's expected behaviour is pretty much set by your userbase.
>>>
>>> In a not-very-relevant aside, I still use Opera 12 for various keyboardy
>>> reasons. Some sites, like community.sitepoint.com (which does have a
>>> separate submit) give me a CSRF error if I hit enter rather than first
>>> focussing on the submit. I suspect this is due to the hidden input not
>>> being sent along with the login/pass on enter (form submit) which some
>>> browsers have been known to have issue with, while *everything* is sent
>>> on the submit-button-click+submit event.
>>>
>>> This might not be an issue with users of non-ancient browsers though.
>>>
>>> _mallory
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:11:28AM +0100, Lynn Holdsworth wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
>>>> textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.
>>>>
>>>> Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
>>>> expected behaviour?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks as always, Lynn
>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Work hard. Have fun. Make history.
>> >> >> >> >>
> > > > >


--
Work hard. Have fun. Make history.

From: Aaron Cannon
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 11:52AM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | Next message →

On my iPhone, the enter key is generally in the bottom right corner of
the keyboard.

Aaron Cannon

On 7/31/15, Birkir R. Gunnarsson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi
>
> No, your average iPhone virtual keyboard does not have an enter key,
> that is what concerns me the most.
> Users of mobile devices running Voiceover will be very likely to view
> your webpage, how are they to activate the search?
> Maybe there is a mechanism already, but it is important to think of
> your mobile device users, disabled or otherwise.
> That´s why I would tentatively call a 2.1.1 issue on this, and say
> that for users of mobile devices there is no way to activate the
> search.
> If the responsive view of the page already takes care of this I think
> I could not call it a WCAG violation, though I would make a usability
> note.
> I, myself, get confused when I do not have a submit button for forms
> that I am filling in.
>
> Cheers
>
>
> On 7/31/15, Aaron Cannon < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>> Don't most mobile keyboards, on-screen or otherwise, provide an enter key?
>>
>> Aaron Cannon
>>
>> On 7/31/15, Birkir R. Gunnarsson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>> How would users of a mobile device submit the form?
>>>
>>> On 7/31/15, _mallory < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>> what happens if I entered searchy text and hit tabr+enter? if I didn't
>>>> see there wasn't a button, I may overshoot the form.
>>>>
>>>> Unless it fails Understandable, which it well might, this may be more
>>>> the realm of so-so usability rather than a direct WCAG violation.
>>>>
>>>> Whether it's expected behaviour is pretty much set by your userbase.
>>>>
>>>> In a not-very-relevant aside, I still use Opera 12 for various keyboardy
>>>> reasons. Some sites, like community.sitepoint.com (which does have a
>>>> separate submit) give me a CSRF error if I hit enter rather than first
>>>> focussing on the submit. I suspect this is due to the hidden input not
>>>> being sent along with the login/pass on enter (form submit) which some
>>>> browsers have been known to have issue with, while *everything* is sent
>>>> on the submit-button-click+submit event.
>>>>
>>>> This might not be an issue with users of non-ancient browsers though.
>>>>
>>>> _mallory
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:11:28AM +0100, Lynn Holdsworth wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
>>>>> textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.
>>>>>
>>>>> Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
>>>>> expected behaviour?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks as always, Lynn
>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Work hard. Have fun. Make history.
>>> >>> >>> >>> >>>
>> >> >> >> >>
>
>
> --
> Work hard. Have fun. Make history.
> > > > >

From: deborah.kaplan
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 12:11PM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
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Not only is this is a usability fail, to me this is a clear cognitive accessibility issue. What if the user doesn't know to press enter? Does the page clearly say to do that? Many users are so accustomed to assuming the only way to submit forms is to click a button, that it wouldn't even occur to them to press enter.

This goes along with the general usability problems of instant search or any instant form submission. Google gets away with it for the same reason Google and Facebook get away with any UI no-nos: people spend enough time on those two sites that they get trained by the sites in how to use those interfaces. But in general, users seem to get pretty confused if there isn't a search button -- and if there is any delay between the time they enter the search query and the time the results appear, they think there is something broken on the page.

The general principle, for basic user experience also for cognitive accessibility, is that common interfaces should behave like all other common interfaces, if some kind of common practices exist everywhere else. The only exception is if there is a good reason -- better than "a 10 x 10 magnifying glass icon with alternative text is still too big for our minimalistic site design." (I'm not saying that the reasoning in this case, Lynn, but that would be the reasoning in parallel cases I've seen.)

Deborah Kaplan

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015, _mallory wrote:

> Hi,
> what happens if I entered searchy text and hit tabr+enter? if I didn't
> see there wasn't a button, I may overshoot the form.
>
> Unless it fails Understandable, which it well might, this may be more
> the realm of so-so usability rather than a direct WCAG violation.
>
> Whether it's expected behaviour is pretty much set by your userbase.
>
> In a not-very-relevant aside, I still use Opera 12 for various keyboardy
> reasons. Some sites, like community.sitepoint.com (which does have a
> separate submit) give me a CSRF error if I hit enter rather than first
> focussing on the submit. I suspect this is due to the hidden input not
> being sent along with the login/pass on enter (form submit) which some
> browsers have been known to have issue with, while *everything* is sent
> on the submit-button-click+submit event.
>
> This might not be an issue with users of non-ancient browsers though.
>
> _mallory
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:11:28AM +0100, Lynn Holdsworth wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
>> textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.
>>
>> Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
>> expected behaviour?
>>
>> Thanks as always, Lynn
>> >> >> >> > > > > --

From: Patrick H. Lauke
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 1:49PM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | Next message →

On 31/07/2015 18:52, Aaron Cannon wrote:
> On my iPhone, the enter key is generally in the bottom right corner of
> the keyboard.
>
> Aaron Cannon
>
> On 7/31/15, Birkir R. Gunnarsson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>> Hi
>>
>> No, your average iPhone virtual keyboard does not have an enter key,
>> that is what concerns me the most.

Indeed, if you're in a text entry field, there's a "GO" button to the
right of the space bar. Using that submits the form (same as when you're
actually typing a URL into the address field in Safari etc)

http://i.imgur.com/27HDses.png

Agree though that it's not a good idea to rely on this, and having an
explicit submit button would be advisable

P
--
Patrick H. Lauke

www.splintered.co.uk | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
http://flickr.com/photos/redux/ | http://redux.deviantart.com
twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke

From: Alexander Schmitz
Date: Fri, Jul 31 2015 1:57PM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | Next message →

I think one place this fails general usability still on an iPhone, is that
it is very common to tap out of a form or use done rather then go, which
just closes the keyboard. In this situation the user now has no obvious way
to submit the form or idea what they should do next. It would not be
intuitive to click back into the input and then press go to submit at that
point.

On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 3:49 PM, Patrick H. Lauke < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
wrote:

> On 31/07/2015 18:52, Aaron Cannon wrote:
>
>> On my iPhone, the enter key is generally in the bottom right corner of
>> the keyboard.
>>
>> Aaron Cannon
>>
>> On 7/31/15, Birkir R. Gunnarsson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> No, your average iPhone virtual keyboard does not have an enter key,
>>> that is what concerns me the most.
>>>
>>
> Indeed, if you're in a text entry field, there's a "GO" button to the
> right of the space bar. Using that submits the form (same as when you're
> actually typing a URL into the address field in Safari etc)
>
> http://i.imgur.com/27HDses.png
>
> Agree though that it's not a good idea to rely on this, and having an
> explicit submit button would be advisable
>
> P
> --
> Patrick H. Lauke
>
> www.splintered.co.uk | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
> http://flickr.com/photos/redux/ | http://redux.deviantart.com
> twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
>
> > > > >

From: Maxability Accessibility for all
Date: Sun, Aug 02 2015 9:01AM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | Next message →

I second with Birkir. On desktop I can press enter to submit the form
even if I dont have a submit button available on the page but on
mobile I cannot do that since the on screen keyboard of Safari on IOS
will not provide it. I will call it as 2.1.1 violation .


I am unaware of the same behaviour on Android and firefox.

Thanks & Regards
Rakesh
www.maxability.co.in
On 7/31/15, Lynn Holdsworth < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I have a search form that's submitted when a user presses Enter in the
> textbox. It doesn't include a submit button.
>
> Does this fail WCAG2 anywhere, or does this fall into the realms of
> expected behaviour?
>
> Thanks as always, Lynn
> > > > >

From: Patrick H. Lauke
Date: Sun, Aug 02 2015 11:38AM
Subject: Re: WCAG2: does a search form without a submit button fail?
← Previous message | No next message

On 02/08/2015 16:01, Maxability Accessibility for all wrote:
> I second with Birkir. On desktop I can press enter to submit the form
> even if I dont have a submit button available on the page but on
> mobile I cannot do that since the on screen keyboard of Safari on IOS
> will not provide it. I will call it as 2.1.1 violation .

However, we established that that's not the case, and that the keyboard
does provide a "Go" key...

P
--
Patrick H. Lauke

www.splintered.co.uk | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
http://flickr.com/photos/redux/ | http://redux.deviantart.com
twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke