E-mail List Archives

Search E-mail List Archives for

Number of posts in this thread: 11 (In chronological order)

From: Jennifer Sutton
Date: Fri, Jun 03 2016 11:45AM
Subject: accessibility and SEO
No previous message | Next message →

Greetings, WebAIM:


I know that accessibility and SEO have been discussed a number of times
on the list, and there have been many articles from the accessibility
industry on the topic.


I'm now pleased to see a series about the topic from someone with a SEO
background who's interested in accessibility.


Below my name are the first three articles, and I think there are a few
more that are in progress. I don't think any of these three have been
posted here, yet, though they have received fairly wide circulation on
Twitter.


Best,

Jennifer



What You Should Know About Accessibility + SEO, Part I An Intro - Moz

https://moz.com/blog/accessibility-seo-1



Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Site & Page Structure Overlaps - Moz

https://moz.com/blog/global-accessibility-awareness-day


Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Formatting & Link Overlaps - Moz

https://moz.com/blog/seo-accessibility-formatting-and-links

From: _mallory
Date: Fri, Jun 03 2016 1:28PM
Subject: Re: accessibility and SEO
← Previous message | Next message →

I have a poor opinion of SEO due to past experiences with it, but
I know the moz site is one of the few that's actually pretty good.

Thanks for these, Jennifer.

_mallory

On Fri, Jun 03, 2016 at 10:45:40AM -0700, Jennifer Sutton wrote:
> Greetings, WebAIM:
>
>
> I know that accessibility and SEO have been discussed a number of
> times on the list, and there have been many articles from the
> accessibility industry on the topic.
>
>
> I'm now pleased to see a series about the topic from someone with a
> SEO background who's interested in accessibility.
>
>
> Below my name are the first three articles, and I think there are a
> few more that are in progress. I don't think any of these three have
> been posted here, yet, though they have received fairly wide
> circulation on Twitter.
>
>
> Best,
>
> Jennifer
>
>
>
> What You Should Know About Accessibility + SEO, Part I An Intro - Moz
>
> https://moz.com/blog/accessibility-seo-1
>
>
>
> Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Site & Page Structure Overlaps - Moz
>
> https://moz.com/blog/global-accessibility-awareness-day
>
>
> Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Formatting & Link Overlaps - Moz
>
> https://moz.com/blog/seo-accessibility-formatting-and-links
>
> > > >

From: L Snider
Date: Sun, Jun 05 2016 11:02AM
Subject: Re: accessibility and SEO
← Previous message | Next message →

Thanks for posting that blog, great information there!

I used to do SEO for years, but always kept accessibility and usability
first, because the search engines loved it! I had one client stay in the
number 1-3 spot for 10 years (never once paid-this was all organic!)...so I
proved my theory over and over...

Basically if you make a good site for humans, all humans, then the SEO is
much easier. Of course there are always tips and tricks (white hat ones and
not ones that will get you banned) that one can do...but in the end the
people who put people first, always did better with the engines.

Cheers

Lisa



On Fri, Jun 3, 2016 at 2:28 PM, _mallory < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:

> I have a poor opinion of SEO due to past experiences with it, but
> I know the moz site is one of the few that's actually pretty good.
>
> Thanks for these, Jennifer.
>
> _mallory
>
> On Fri, Jun 03, 2016 at 10:45:40AM -0700, Jennifer Sutton wrote:
> > Greetings, WebAIM:
> >
> >
> > I know that accessibility and SEO have been discussed a number of
> > times on the list, and there have been many articles from the
> > accessibility industry on the topic.
> >
> >
> > I'm now pleased to see a series about the topic from someone with a
> > SEO background who's interested in accessibility.
> >
> >
> > Below my name are the first three articles, and I think there are a
> > few more that are in progress. I don't think any of these three have
> > been posted here, yet, though they have received fairly wide
> > circulation on Twitter.
> >
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Jennifer
> >
> >
> >
> > What You Should Know About Accessibility + SEO, Part I An Intro - Moz
> >
> > https://moz.com/blog/accessibility-seo-1
> >
> >
> >
> > Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Site & Page Structure Overlaps - Moz
> >
> > https://moz.com/blog/global-accessibility-awareness-day
> >
> >
> > Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Formatting & Link Overlaps - Moz
> >
> > https://moz.com/blog/seo-accessibility-formatting-and-links
> >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >

From: Linda Ferguson
Date: Sun, Jun 05 2016 12:24PM
Subject: Re: accessibility and SEO
← Previous message | Next message →

Jennifer,

I too have been following the articles on mox by Laura Lippay. Thanks for
posting them here.

I am a consultant in both areas. I find it a struggle to get many in the
SEO field to understand the importance of considering accessibility. They
want to know how making a site accessible can improve user engagement and
ROI. But it's often difficult to prove that accessibility efforts boost
user engagement metrics. So many other things can have an influence
(marketing campaigns, technical SEO updates, etc.). Even when I give them
the business case that they can increase their audience by ~20% by making a
site accessible, that doesn't seem to be enough to convince many folks.
I've also pointed a few folks in the direction of the recent WAI business
case publication (https://www.w3.org/WAI/bcase/).

Mallory, I can understand your bad experiences with SEOs. There are a lot
of sub-par companies out there. Fortunately, SEO is no longer about keyword
stuffing or other black hat techniques. The changes in the Google algorithm
over the past few years means that Google rewards sites that use SEO best
practices and penalizes sites who try to game the system. The best SEOs
know that it is all about relevant, usable, engaging, and accessible
content.

The comments on Laura's posts show a lot of enthusiasm about learning more
about accessibility. Progress - yeah! In the meantime, I'm doing my best to
do one-on-one evangelizing. If anyone has any business case ideas (other
than what's outlined in the WAI piece) that might influence SEO folks, I'd
love to hear them.

-Linda

From: _mallory
Date: Tue, Jun 07 2016 1:23PM
Subject: Re: accessibility and SEO
← Previous message | Next message →

On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 02:24:51PM -0400, Linda Ferguson wrote:
> Mallory, I can understand your bad experiences with SEOs. There are a lot
> of sub-par companies out there. Fortunately, SEO is no longer about keyword
> stuffing or other black hat techniques. The changes in the Google algorithm
> over the past few years means that Google rewards sites that use SEO best
> practices and penalizes sites who try to game the system. The best SEOs
> know that it is all about relevant, usable, engaging, and accessible
> content.

An "expert" from one of the Netherlands' largest marketing & SEO
companies (not Joost btw!) said having headings in the footer
"confused Google" and would therefore lower rankings. Another from
that same company said, over another client site, that "more than
4 h2's on a page dilutes Google rankings". Boiled my blood.

As a low-wage front-end dev, I could only do what they said after
arguing my case. Since the headings had to be removed but also
needed to keep their heading-like styles, I used a class name
that was the URL to the WCAG failure example where p's and spans
are styled like headings to keep these now-p's styled as
headings. Two sites with this are still live and I point to them
regularly.

Also a lot of the content that recenty at NCDT (the Dutch National
Congress on Digital Accessibility) Gerry McGovern called "bullsh*t"
(as it's created by companies to feel good about themselves
rather than to actually give value to real users/customers) was also
encouraged by these SEO companies "because Google values content"
(which is true, it's just that the examples were useless for what
real humans looked for in sites like those we were building).

They were in general anti-stuffing/anti-cloaking, they did not go
into anything we'd call black-hat, but this too was a detriment:
hidden headings for screen-reader accessibility was often flagged
as "cloaking" and I had to remove headings of landmark areas
regularly (luckily I could get almost the same effect with aria-label
which these companies ignored). Linking to the video by Matt Cutts
himself stating accessibility would not be punished by Google was
not enough.

I don't blame the clients believing the "large prominant SEO company
with many famous clients" over the minimum-wage front-ender of some
small e-commerce company. But I heard these sorts of things so
regularly, it soured me permanently.

cheers,
_mallory

From: Jennifer Sutton
Date: Tue, Jun 07 2016 1:38PM
Subject: Re: accessibility and SEO
← Previous message | Next message →

Here's another article in this series. I think it may be the last:


Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Images, Video and Non-Text Elements - Moz

https://moz.com/blog/seo-accessibility-images-video


> <snip content from the first message in the thread>

>
> What You Should Know About Accessibility + SEO, Part I An Intro - Moz
>
> https://moz.com/blog/accessibility-seo-1
>
>
>
> Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Site & Page Structure Overlaps - Moz
>
> https://moz.com/blog/global-accessibility-awareness-day
>
>
> Optimizing for Accessibility + SEO Formatting & Link Overlaps - Moz
>
> https://moz.com/blog/seo-accessibility-formatting-and-links
>

From: England, Kristina
Date: Fri, Jun 10 2016 1:21PM
Subject: Re: Accessibility and Form Autofocus on a Login Page
← Previous message | Next message →

Hi Everyone,

We are implementing an updated single sign on login page. There were too major issues that arose, one around form autofocus. Basically, when a person navigates to the login page, the screen reader begins reading the page at the User ID field as it's set to autofocus. This means that the screen reader skips a few things - the page name and header, a ticker that alerts people of any expected and unexpected downtime, and also, if they enter their username or password wrong, when the page refreshes, the error is above the User ID field, so it isn't read. Has anyone encountered this issue before? What is the recommended standard and potential solutions?

Thanks!



:: Kristina England, Communications Specialist, PMP
:: Strategy, Research, and Communications
:: University Information Technology Services (UITS)
:: University of Massachusetts Office of the President
:: 774-455-7874
:: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =

University of Massachusetts : 333 South St. : Suite 400 : Shrewsbury, MA 01545

University of Massachusetts Website: http://www.massachusetts.edu
UMass Office of the President Website: http://www.umassp.edu
UMass Innovation & Efficiency News: http://www.umassonthemove.net

From: Meacham, Steve - FSA, Kansas City, MO
Date: Fri, Jun 10 2016 1:32PM
Subject: Re: Accessibility and Form Autofocus on a Login Page
← Previous message | Next message →

Tickers can also be a problem. Moving text can be very distracting/disabling to persons with certain cognitive disabilities, and may be unreadable to others.

From: England, Kristina
Date: Fri, Jun 10 2016 1:35PM
Subject: Re: Accessibility and Form Autofocus on a Login Page
← Previous message | Next message →

Sorry. A ticker was definitely the wrong of describing it. It's a stationary banner that appears at the top of the page when an alert is activated.

From: Moore,Michael (Accessibility) (HHSC)
Date: Fri, Jun 10 2016 2:15PM
Subject: Re: Accessibility and Form Autofocus on a Login Page
← Previous message | Next message →

This is pretty common in applications and I don't see placing focus in the log-in field as a serious problem. It is very easy to navigate back to the top of the page if I need more information but in most cases what I want to do is to log in so I am right where I want to be.

When the page refreshes and an error message is displayed you could add it to the User ID field description using aria-describedby.

Mike Moore
Accessibility Coordinator
Texas Health and Human Services Commission
Civil Rights Office
(512) 438-3431 (Office)

From: Joseph Sherman
Date: Fri, Jun 10 2016 2:49PM
Subject: Re: Accessibility and Form Autofocus on a Login Page
← Previous message | No next message

If the user is navigating to the login page it seems reasonable to put them in the user id field.

For error messages you can use the wai forms tutorial info. http://www.w3.org/WAI/tutorials/forms/

Joseph

On Jun 10, 2016 3:22 PM, "England, Kristina" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
Hi Everyone,

We are implementing an updated single sign on login page. There were too major issues that arose, one around form autofocus. Basically, when a person navigates to the login page, the screen reader begins reading the page at the User ID field as it's set to autofocus. This means that the screen reader skips a few things - the page name and header, a ticker that alerts people of any expected and unexpected downtime, and also, if they enter their username or password wrong, when the page refreshes, the error is above the User ID field, so it isn't read. Has anyone encountered this issue before? What is the recommended standard and potential solutions?

Thanks!



:: Kristina England, Communications Specialist, PMP
:: Strategy, Research, and Communications
:: University Information Technology Services (UITS)
:: University of Massachusetts Office of the President
:: 774-455-7874
:: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =

University of Massachusetts : 333 South St. : Suite 400 : Shrewsbury, MA 01545

University of Massachusetts Website: http://www.massachusetts.edu
UMass Office of the President Website: http://www.umassp.edu
UMass Innovation & Efficiency News: http://www.umassonthemove.net