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Thread: Select drop-downs in VoiceOver on iPhone
Number of posts in this thread: 9 (In chronological order)
From: Alastair Campbell
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 7:57AM
Subject: Select drop-downs in VoiceOver on iPhone
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Hi everyone,
I'm wondering if there's a gesture I'm missing or something, as it seems
like select drop-downs don't work in iOS VoiceOver on the iPhone?
I was testing a site, but I created a cut-down page to highlight the issue:
http://alastairc.ac/testing/select-drop-down.html
When selecting the drop-down, the 'wheel' comes up, but swiping around
doesn't get to it. It is fine on the iPad (which uses an inline drop-down),
but not the iPhone.
Has anyone else encountered this?
-Alastair
From: Pratik Patel
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 8:15AM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
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Alastair,
With Voiceover on the iPhone, double tapping the select button pops up an
iOS selector. Swiping up and down will allows the user to choose the items.
Pressing the done button allows one to confirm. It's awkward but doable.
Your test below works well. I just tested it.
Regards,
Pratik
Pratik Patel
Founder and CEO, EZFire
T: 718-928-5529
M: 718-249-7019
E: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = (or = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = )
Follow me on Twitter: @ppatel
Follow me on LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/pratik-patel/9/985/882
Skype: Patel.pratik
-----Original Message-----
From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
[mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Alastair Campbell
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2013 9:57 AM
To: WebAIM Discussion List
Subject: [WebAIM] Select drop-downs in VoiceOver on iPhone
Hi everyone,
I'm wondering if there's a gesture I'm missing or something, as it seems
like select drop-downs don't work in iOS VoiceOver on the iPhone?
I was testing a site, but I created a cut-down page to highlight the issue:
http://alastairc.ac/testing/select-drop-down.html
When selecting the drop-down, the 'wheel' comes up, but swiping around
doesn't get to it. It is fine on the iPad (which uses an inline drop-down),
but not the iPhone.
Has anyone else encountered this?
-Alastair
From: Jonathan C. Cohn
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 8:30AM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in VoiceOver on iPhone
← Previous message | Next message →
To elaborate on the first response, there is a picker item in the lower half of the screen. It is a bit confusing because the top half of the screen has has the drop down menu item but it does not respond to any gestures, and the picker item is after the done button in swipe order. It would be less confusing if focus moved down if you activate the menu.
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 23, 2013, at 9:57 AM, Alastair Campbell < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I'm wondering if there's a gesture I'm missing or something, as it seems
> like select drop-downs don't work in iOS VoiceOver on the iPhone?
>
> I was testing a site, but I created a cut-down page to highlight the issue:
> http://alastairc.ac/testing/select-drop-down.html
>
> When selecting the drop-down, the 'wheel' comes up, but swiping around
> doesn't get to it. It is fine on the iPad (which uses an inline drop-down),
> but not the iPhone.
>
> Has anyone else encountered this?
>
> -Alastair
> > >
From: Alastair Campbell
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 9:00AM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
← Previous message | Next message →
Pratik Patel wrote:
> Swiping up and down will allows the user to choose the items.
> Pressing the done button allows one to confirm. It's awkward but doable.
Ah, thanks. That is rather inconsistent, I wonder why left/right doesn't
work? Having used VoiceOver for a while it didn't even occur to me that
up/down would work for that (although in hindsight it's an obvious thing to
try!)
I've just sat through three usability tests with two beginner and one very
advanced user, and select-drop downs stopped all of them.
Thanks,
-Alastair
From: Detlev Fischer
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 2:17PM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
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We had the very same issue in an accessibility test of the mobile site of a German phone operator recently. The blind tester could not get anywhere using the native select (the iOS 'fruit machne' widget) but told us that it did work in other cases on his iPhone. Not sure what made the difference implementation wise. I'd like to check the advice of Patrik on that site.
Incidently, there was just a link shared out there on twitter by @AlexOnUX on why selects aren't a good choice for navigation on mobile which I'd like to pass on: http://buff.ly/ZiDzH4
Best, Detlev
On 23 Apr 2013, at 17:00, Alastair Campbell wrote:
> Pratik Patel wrote:
>
>> Swiping up and down will allows the user to choose the items.
>> Pressing the done button allows one to confirm. It's awkward but doable.
>
>
> Ah, thanks. That is rather inconsistent, I wonder why left/right doesn't
> work? Having used VoiceOver for a while it didn't even occur to me that
> up/down would work for that (although in hindsight it's an obvious thing to
> try!)
>
> I've just sat through three usability tests with two beginner and one very
> advanced user, and select-drop downs stopped all of them.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -Alastair
> > > --
Detlev Fischer
testkreis - das Accessibility-Team von feld.wald.wiese
c/o feld.wald.wiese
Thedestraße 2
22767 Hamburg
Tel +49 (0)40 439 10 68-3
Mobil +49 (0)1577 170 73 84
Fax +49 (0)40 439 10 68-5
http://www.testkreis.de
Beratung, Tests und Schulungen für barrierefreie Websites
From: Alastair Campbell
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 3:58PM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
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Detlev Fischer wrote:
> The blind tester could not get anywhere using the native select (the iOS
> 'fruit machne' widget) but told us that it did work in other cases on his
> iPhone.
A part of it might be labelling, so that people know it is a selection
widget (the example we tested was missing explicit labels). The other part
is definitely that you can't do what normally works: swipe right for the
next option.
> Incidently, there was just a link shared out there on twitter by @AlexOnUX
> on why selects aren't a good choice for navigation on mobile which I'd like
> to pass on: http://buff.ly/ZiDzH4
>
I generally agree with those points, but in this case it was not for
navigation, it was for selecting one option among many, and a
select-drop-down is appropriate.
Cheers,
-Alastair
From: Pratik Patel
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 7:46PM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
← Previous message | Next message →
Detlev,
I'm happy to provide you feedback. Feel free to send me a link privately if
you wish. Lack of label is the most prevalent issue for most select UI
components on iOS.
Regards,
Pratik Patel
Founder and CEO, EZFire
T: 718-928-5529
M: 718-249-7019
E: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = (or = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = )
Follow me on Twitter: @ppatel
Follow me on LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/pratik-patel/9/985/882
Skype: Patel.pratik
-----Original Message-----
From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
[mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Detlev Fischer
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2013 4:18 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
We had the very same issue in an accessibility test of the mobile site of a
German phone operator recently. The blind tester could not get anywhere
using the native select (the iOS 'fruit machne' widget) but told us that it
did work in other cases on his iPhone. Not sure what made the difference
implementation wise. I'd like to check the advice of Patrik on that site.
Incidently, there was just a link shared out there on twitter by @AlexOnUX
on why selects aren't a good choice for navigation on mobile which I'd like
to pass on: http://buff.ly/ZiDzH4
Best, Detlev
On 23 Apr 2013, at 17:00, Alastair Campbell wrote:
> Pratik Patel wrote:
>
>> Swiping up and down will allows the user to choose the items.
>> Pressing the done button allows one to confirm. It's awkward but doable.
>
>
> Ah, thanks. That is rather inconsistent, I wonder why left/right doesn't
> work? Having used VoiceOver for a while it didn't even occur to me that
> up/down would work for that (although in hindsight it's an obvious thing
to
> try!)
>
> I've just sat through three usability tests with two beginner and one very
> advanced user, and select-drop downs stopped all of them.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -Alastair
> > > --
Detlev Fischer
testkreis - das Accessibility-Team von feld.wald.wiese
c/o feld.wald.wiese
Thedestraße 2
22767 Hamburg
Tel +49 (0)40 439 10 68-3
Mobil +49 (0)1577 170 73 84
Fax +49 (0)40 439 10 68-5
http://www.testkreis.de
Beratung, Tests und Schulungen für barrierefreie Websites
From: Pratik Patel
Date: Tue, Apr 23 2013 7:55PM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
← Previous message | Next message →
Alastair Campbell Wrote:
Pratik Patel wrote:
> Swiping up and down will allows the user to choose the items.
> Pressing the done button allows one to confirm. It's awkward but doable.
Ah, thanks. That is rather inconsistent, I wonder why left/right doesn't
work? Having used VoiceOver for a while it didn't even occur to me that
up/down would work for that (although in hindsight it's an obvious thing to
try!)
It is actually consistent and expected behavior. Sliders also work in the
same manner. If you look at Native time and date components, for instance,
they work in the same way. The problem is Apple inconsistently implementing
these in Safari--meaning that they should appears as if they were native.
This would prevent users from looking for an unexpected modal dialog at the
bottom. This is what causes the usability issues and not necessarily the
up/down gestures. If hints are enabled, VO clearly identifies the gestures.
From: Alastair Campbell
Date: Wed, Apr 24 2013 3:23AM
Subject: Re: Select drop-downs in Voiceover on iPhone
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Pratik Patel wrote:
> It is actually consistent and expected behavior.
>
Perhaps to you, but it wasn't expected for at least 3 VoiceOver users. (I
don't include myself as I'm not a real user).
> The problem is Apple inconsistently implementing these in Safari--meaning
> that they should appears as if they were native.
>
I guess we're saying the same thing then, they aren't recognised as the
native widget if opened in Safari without proper labelling.
Thanks,
-Alastair