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Number of posts in this thread: 6 (In chronological order)

From: Dennis Deacon
Date: Sat, Aug 15 2015 9:46AM
Subject: Table captions and page headings
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Presently (not to say it's the appropriate way), many of our data tables
have page headings immediately above the table. To date, we've added table
captions to existing tables, and in some cases, used the immediately
previous page heading as it best describes the table.

I considered add a page heading within the caption tag. It validates via
HTML5 validator, however, the VO screen reader does not read it. Maybe
improper semantics or screen reader snafu. I can style the caption to look
at a heading, to visually eliminate the duplication, but is that truly the
best approach?

--
Dennis Deacon
Email: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
Twitter(s): @deconspray
LinkedIn Profile: linkedin.com/in/dennisdeacon

From: Léonie Watson
Date: Sat, Aug 15 2015 11:01AM
Subject: Re: Table captions and page headings
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> From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> On Behalf Of Dennis Deacon
> Sent: 15 August 2015 16:46
> Presently (not to say it's the appropriate way), many of our data tables have
> page headings immediately above the table. To date, we've added table
> captions to existing tables, and in some cases, used the immediately previous
> page heading as it best describes the table.
>
> I considered add a page heading within the caption tag. It validates via
> HTML5 validator, however, the VO screen reader does not read it. Maybe
> improper semantics or screen reader snafu. I can style the caption to look at
> a heading, to visually eliminate the duplication, but is that truly the best
> approach?


The easiest approach would be to drop the heading, and use only the table with its caption. Most screen readers have a shortcut for navigating between tables, so a heading offers no particular navigational value. The caption is either announced automatically, or available as part of the table content, so if the heading duplicates the caption it offers no additional value there either.

Léonie.

--
Senior accessibility engineer @PacielloGroup @LeonieWatson

From: Jared Smith
Date: Sat, Aug 15 2015 11:05AM
Subject: Re: Table captions and page headings
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Another approach is to use aria-labelledby to reference the heading
from the table. This should provide the same functionality as the
table caption without losing the added usefulness of the heading.
You'll need to test to make sure this functions correctly.

Jared

From: Olaf Drümmer
Date: Sat, Aug 15 2015 5:33PM
Subject: Re: Table captions and page headings
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Please keep in mind screen readers are just one out of many types of assistive technologies/ways to access content, To change something just to accommodate screen readers (or their users) tends be inappropriate.

Olaf


On 15 Aug 2015, at 19:01, Léonie Watson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:

>> From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
>> On Behalf Of Dennis Deacon
>> Sent: 15 August 2015 16:46
>> Presently (not to say it's the appropriate way), many of our data tables have
>> page headings immediately above the table. To date, we've added table
>> captions to existing tables, and in some cases, used the immediately previous
>> page heading as it best describes the table.
>>
>> I considered add a page heading within the caption tag. It validates via
>> HTML5 validator, however, the VO screen reader does not read it. Maybe
>> improper semantics or screen reader snafu. I can style the caption to look at
>> a heading, to visually eliminate the duplication, but is that truly the best
>> approach?
>
>
> The easiest approach would be to drop the heading, and use only the table with its caption. Most screen readers have a shortcut for navigating between tables, so a heading offers no particular navigational value. The caption is either announced automatically, or available as part of the table content, so if the heading duplicates the caption it offers no additional value there either.
>
> Léonie.
>
> --
> Senior accessibility engineer @PacielloGroup @LeonieWatson
>

From: Léonie Watson
Date: Sun, Aug 16 2015 2:46AM
Subject: Re: Table captions and page headings
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> From: Olaf Drümmer [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
> Sent: 16 August 2015 00:33
> Please keep in mind screen readers are just one out of many types of
> assistive technologies/ways to access content, To change something just to
> accommodate screen readers (or their users) tends be inappropriate.


Agreed. Do you think the heading (as a duplicate of a visible caption) would
be beneficial to others? I couldn't immediately think of ways it might be -
but that doesn't mean to say there aren't of course.

Léonie.

From: Olaf Drümmer
Date: Sun, Aug 16 2015 3:51AM
Subject: Re: Table captions and page headings
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At first glance I thought of page heading as a running header for a page in a paginated document, e.g. PDFor EPUB. In that case a page heading / running page header is background information aiding in orientation (answering the question "Where am I, if one jumps into the middle of the book"), and redundancy has to exist by definition.

But it seems the original poster had an HTML page in mind. As far as i know page heading is not a term of art in HTML land. I guess it is just a heading at the top of the HTML page? And not a HTML page title, right? And also not some heading in the middle of an HTML page?

I would address the problem from a general perspective, not from an accessibility perspective: why is there possibly a first heading on the HTML page whose content is possibly repeated in a table's caption. I would also like to ask: is the table essentially the only content on the page? If not, would the heading also be descriptive of the other content on the page? Then keeping the heading and the caption would be just fine. Or is it just there because it follows a certain pattern chosen for a related set of HTML pages? Then sticking to the pattern could be useful for consistency's sake, even though it might create redundancy.

Either way - once it has been established, why there might be redundant headings and captions, and whether that is a good idea in general or not, the best approach should be applied from a general point of view. Next, if that leads to pages with some such redundancy as described by the original poster, it is what is. If users in general have to bear presentation of redundant content, then from my point of view a user using a screen reader will have to bear the same.

Olaf


On 16 Aug 2015, at 10:46, Léonie Watson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:

>> From: Olaf Drümmer [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ]
>> Sent: 16 August 2015 00:33
>> Please keep in mind screen readers are just one out of many types of
>> assistive technologies/ways to access content, To change something just to
>> accommodate screen readers (or their users) tends be inappropriate.
>
>
> Agreed. Do you think the heading (as a duplicate of a visible caption) would
> be beneficial to others? I couldn't immediately think of ways it might be -
> but that doesn't mean to say there aren't of course.
>
> Léonie.
>
>
>
>
>