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Thread: Checking and Fixing PDFs With a Screen Reader?
Number of posts in this thread: 5 (In chronological order)
From: Brandon Keith Biggs
Date: Wed, May 22 2019 3:23PM
Subject: Checking and Fixing PDFs With a Screen Reader?
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Hello,
Is there any way to run an accessibility check that is readable (and
preferably free) that is usable with a screen reader?
Then what is the best way to fix those issues if the document is coming
from Word?
Thank you,
Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>;
From: glen walker
Date: Wed, May 22 2019 3:33PM
Subject: Re: Checking and Fixing PDFs With a Screen Reader?
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A few months ago we talked about the accessibility of the checker in word.
See https://webaim.org/discussion/mail_thread?thread=9180
On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 3:23 PM Brandon Keith Biggs <
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hello,
> Is there any way to run an accessibility check that is readable (and
> preferably free) that is usable with a screen reader?
> Then what is the best way to fix those issues if the document is coming
> from Word?
> Thank you,
>
> Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>;
> > > > >
From: Peter Quale
Date: Wed, May 22 2019 5:24PM
Subject: Re: Checking and Fixing PDFs With a Screen Reader?
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Hi Brandon,
Reading through the PDF with a screen reader is pretty straightforward as
you're looking for a logical reading order that matches the visible order
of the content in each page and then look for appropriate headings and
heading levels.
You might check out the "Screen Reader Output" report found in the PAC 3
tool
<https://www.access-for-all.ch/en/pdf-lab/pdf-accessibility-checker-pac/downloading-pac.html>
available free from Access for All in Switzerland. I'm consistently
impressed with the accuracy.
As for Word, as long as your documents avoid tables or other wacky layouts
and again follow a logical heading structure, the results are usually
favorable. Be sure to always us the "heading" styles and avoid other
options like "Title" as there is no equivalent in the PDF tags. Then fixing
the documents is pretty easy-- just go in and adjust headings as necessary.
Oh, and rely on the style spacing provided by Word and remove all extra
lines and useless spaces as the screen readers will likely try to read them
as "blank, blank, blank".
If you need documents that meet the PDF/UA spec, you can use the issues
indicated by the PAC 3 tool and search for the specific error text-- Google
results will often bring up pages from Kenny Moore's site, TaggedPDF.com,
where he includes excellent step-by-step instructions to fix each one.
-Peter
On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 4:33 PM glen walker < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> A few months ago we talked about the accessibility of the checker in word.
> See https://webaim.org/discussion/mail_thread?thread=9180
>
>
> On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 3:23 PM Brandon Keith Biggs <
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> > Is there any way to run an accessibility check that is readable (and
> > preferably free) that is usable with a screen reader?
> > Then what is the best way to fix those issues if the document is coming
> > from Word?
> > Thank you,
> >
> > Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>;
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > >
--
*Peter Quale*
Google Voice: (707) 992-5696
From: Karlen Communications
Date: Thu, May 23 2019 6:51AM
Subject: Re: Checking and Fixing PDFs With a Screen Reader?
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The first issue is that for those of us who use screen readers, we can't
"see" the visible page," we can only see the parts of the page that are
tagged. So, we don't know if content that should be tagged has been tagged.
The second issue is that we are always in "virtual view" of HTML and PDF.
This means we read the content via the Tags and the screen reader buffer
goes ahead, gathers the content and then renders it to us in a more even
flow of information...instead of starting and stopping while more
content/Tags are accessed.
So, someone who is wholly dependent on a screen reader cannot effectively
remediate PDF documents. It is the nature of the format.
If we try to use something like PAC, we don't have access to the visual part
of the PAC window that shows us the page and location of the errors. Screen
reader view is meant only to give a more visual look at what screen readers
will "see" and not four use by those of us who do use screen readers.
Remediating and providing quality assurance for PDF is a very visual, often
mouse driven activity. In terms of using our mouse cursors, we start and
stop at the point in the buffer, not necessarily the point on the visible
page which makes using the mouse cursor impossible/not practical for any
type of remediation.
We CAN go down the Tags Tree and use F2 to edit Tags if we determine that
the Tags are wrong, or to add Tags and structure if we determine that the
Tags added are not correct, but we can't determine if content is not tagged
and add it if we depend on a screen reader for access to PDF documents.
Cheers, Karen
-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of Peter
Quale
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2019 7:24 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Checking and Fixing PDFs With a Screen Reader?
Hi Brandon,
Reading through the PDF with a screen reader is pretty straightforward as
you're looking for a logical reading order that matches the visible order of
the content in each page and then look for appropriate headings and heading
levels.
You might check out the "Screen Reader Output" report found in the PAC 3
tool
<https://www.access-for-all.ch/en/pdf-lab/pdf-accessibility-checker-pac/down
loading-pac.html>
available free from Access for All in Switzerland. I'm consistently
impressed with the accuracy.
As for Word, as long as your documents avoid tables or other wacky layouts
and again follow a logical heading structure, the results are usually
favorable. Be sure to always us the "heading" styles and avoid other options
like "Title" as there is no equivalent in the PDF tags. Then fixing the
documents is pretty easy-- just go in and adjust headings as necessary.
Oh, and rely on the style spacing provided by Word and remove all extra
lines and useless spaces as the screen readers will likely try to read them
as "blank, blank, blank".
If you need documents that meet the PDF/UA spec, you can use the issues
indicated by the PAC 3 tool and search for the specific error text-- Google
results will often bring up pages from Kenny Moore's site, TaggedPDF.com,
where he includes excellent step-by-step instructions to fix each one.
-Peter
On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 4:33 PM glen walker < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> A few months ago we talked about the accessibility of the checker in word.
> See https://webaim.org/discussion/mail_thread?thread=9180
>
>
> On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 3:23 PM Brandon Keith Biggs <
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> > Is there any way to run an accessibility check that is readable (and
> > preferably free) that is usable with a screen reader?
> > Then what is the best way to fix those issues if the document is
> > coming from Word?
> > Thank you,
> >
> > Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>;
> > > > > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > >
> > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> >
--
*Peter Quale*
Google Voice: (707) 992-5696
http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
From: Brandon Keith Biggs
Date: Fri, May 24 2019 6:57AM
Subject: Re: Checking and Fixing PDFs With a Screen Reader?
← Previous message | No next message
Hello,
Thank you! I looked at the PAC tool and I had a difficult time
understanding what the report said, but I did see some items, like labeling
of references, that I'm not sure how to do in Word.
Also, many of the links in the document are citations and links to the
citation that is above the link, so as a screen reader user, I know the
link is to that citation.
Thanks,
Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>;
On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 4:24 PM Peter Quale < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi Brandon,
>
> Reading through the PDF with a screen reader is pretty straightforward as
> you're looking for a logical reading order that matches the visible order
> of the content in each page and then look for appropriate headings and
> heading levels.
>
> You might check out the "Screen Reader Output" report found in the PAC 3
> tool
> <
> https://www.access-for-all.ch/en/pdf-lab/pdf-accessibility-checker-pac/downloading-pac.html
> >
> available free from Access for All in Switzerland. I'm consistently
> impressed with the accuracy.
>
> As for Word, as long as your documents avoid tables or other wacky layouts
> and again follow a logical heading structure, the results are usually
> favorable. Be sure to always us the "heading" styles and avoid other
> options like "Title" as there is no equivalent in the PDF tags. Then fixing
> the documents is pretty easy-- just go in and adjust headings as necessary.
> Oh, and rely on the style spacing provided by Word and remove all extra
> lines and useless spaces as the screen readers will likely try to read them
> as "blank, blank, blank".
>
> If you need documents that meet the PDF/UA spec, you can use the issues
> indicated by the PAC 3 tool and search for the specific error text-- Google
> results will often bring up pages from Kenny Moore's site, TaggedPDF.com,
> where he includes excellent step-by-step instructions to fix each one.
>
> -Peter
>
> On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 4:33 PM glen walker < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> > A few months ago we talked about the accessibility of the checker in
> word.
> > See https://webaim.org/discussion/mail_thread?thread=9180
> >
> >
> > On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 3:23 PM Brandon Keith Biggs <
> > = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> >
> > > Hello,
> > > Is there any way to run an accessibility check that is readable (and
> > > preferably free) that is usable with a screen reader?
> > > Then what is the best way to fix those issues if the document is coming
> > > from Word?
> > > Thank you,
> > >
> > > Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>;
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
>
>
> --
> *Peter Quale*
> Google Voice: (707) 992-5696
> > > > >