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Re: ARIA tabs interaction
From: Jim Allan
Date: Apr 29, 2016 3:23PM
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On Fri, Apr 29, 2016 at 3:45 PM, _mallory < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> This is already the problem. Tabs worked for sighted keyboarders,
> but now they don't.
> Honestly, whenever some committee decides to change how the web
> has traditionally does things, it should insist that all developers
> who do this add visible plain-text for all of us telling us the
> new way of doing things. I suck as badly at guessing the new
> unicorn keystrokes that will now work as much as I suck at
> guessing what the squiggly eyeball icon with no label text means.
> Because on the web, this is a very new, and different, way of
> doing things. Sighted people are not psychic. The web doesn't
> act like desktop. Mousers don't double-click there. Things styled
> with CSS to emulate fake tabs have traditionally been anchors,
> and anchors can be tabbed to with tab. Or so we have been tricked
> to believe in the past.
> I kinda wish I could force everyone to watch real humans slowly
> curse at their keyboards and wonder why they had to be unlucky
> enough to be born too stupid to figure out how to use a computer
> whenever they run across these things. It will break your hearts.
> On Thu, Apr 28, 2016 at 05:43:46PM +0000, Bryan Garaventa wrote:
> > The danger of this logic being, if everybody does this differently,
> nobody will ever understand what is expected now or in the future.
> > Bryan Garaventa
> > Accessibility Fellow
> > SSB BART Group, Inc.
> > <EMAIL REMOVED>
> > 415.624.2709 (o)
> > www.SSBBartGroup.com
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
> Behalf Of Detlev Fischer
> > Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 9:14 AM
> > To: <EMAIL REMOVED>
> > Subject: Re: [WebAIM] ARIA tabs interaction
> > The best practice (to use arrow keys within tab lists for focuusing
> tabs) has always be conceptually difficult as there is no clear conceptual
> separation of tabbed navigation areas where you expect tabbing to work, and
> tab-panel like structures where (accorfding to ARIA best practices) arrow
> keys should be used. That is why many developers chose to support tabbing
> to tabs nad you find very different implementations with variants regarding
> the use of ARIA. For menus proper, i.e. the Menubar widget that really
> implement an application pulldowen menu like
> https://hanshillen.github.io/jqtest/#goto_menubar the situation is
> > So to answer the question, I personally don't see it as wrong to allow
> the user to tab through the top-level menu items, certainly niot for
> navigation menus, and I I see definite usability advantages of supporting
> both arrowing and tabbing for tabs in tab panels even if this deviates from
> ARIA best practice.
> > Detlev
> > --
> > Detlev Fischer
> > testkreis c/o feld.wald.wiese
> > Thedestr. 2, 22767 Hamburg
> > Mobil +49 (0)157 57 57 57 45
> > Fax +49 (0)40 439 10 68-5
> > http://www.testkreis.de
> > Beratung, Tests und Schulungen fÃ¼r barrierefreie Websites
> > Joseph Sherman schrieb am 28.04.2016 16:29:
> > > The design guide for ARIA menu tabs uses the "Tab" key to get into the
> > > tabs list, and then the arrow keys to move through the menu tabs and
> > > menu items. In my experience users, especially without a screen
> > > reader, expect the "Tab" key to move to the next menu Tab and are
> > > confused when the "Tab" key skips the menu tabs. Is it "wrong" to
> > > follow the guide but allow the user to tab through the top-level menu
> > >
> > >
> > > Joseph
> > >
> > > > > > > > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > > > >
> > > > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
Jim Allan, Accessibility Coordinator
Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
voice 512.206.9315 fax: 512.206.9264 http://www.tsbvi.edu/
"We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." McLuhan, 1964