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Re: When "Alt" is not the semantically-correct representation of an image

for

From: Steve Faulkner
Date: Jul 28, 2018 7:50AM

Ryan, no worries, and I agree with your point :-)

--

Regards

SteveF
Current Standards Work @W3C
<http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-standards-work-at-w3c/>;

On 28 July 2018 at 14:45, Ryan E. Benson < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:

> Steve, I wasn't specifically talking about that part or to you, apologies
> if you thought that. I was commenting on how people were saying how it
> would work with JAWS and NVDA, but Voice Over may have issues.
>
> Ryan E. Benson
>
> On Sat, Jul 28, 2018, 09:35 Steve Faulkner < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> wrote:
>
> > Hi Ryan, that's why it says in the spec:
> >
> > " Sometimes, an image only contains text, and the purpose of the image is
> > to display text using visual effects and /or fonts. It is *strongly*
> > recommended that text styled using CSS be used, but if this is not
> > possible, provide the same text in the alt attribute as is in the image.
> "
> > https://www.w3.org/TR/html/semantics-embedded-content.
> html#images-of-text
> >
> > --
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > SteveF
> > Current Standards Work @W3C
> > <http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-
> standards-work-at-w3c/>
> >
> > On 28 July 2018 at 14:29, Ryan E. Benson < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> >
> > > Just a friendly reminder that accessibility stretches past screen
> > readers.
> > > I can't test right now, but this could cause headaches for people who
> > > magnify the screen versus using a screen reader, depending on how the
> > text
> > > is hidden.
> > >
> > > Ryan E. Benson
> > >
> > > On Sat, Jul 28, 2018, 02:40 Steve Faulkner < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > The HTML spec includes advice/examples along these lines:
> > > >
> > > > Images of text
> > > > https://www.w3.org/TR/html/semantics-embedded-content.
> > > html#images-of-text
> > > > Inline images
> > > >
> > https://www.w3.org/TR/html/semantics-embedded-content.html#inline-images
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > >
> > > > SteveF
> > > > Current Standards Work @W3C
> > > > <http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/2015/03/current-
> > > standards-work-at-w3c/>
> > > >
> > > > On 28 July 2018 at 05:25, Birkir R. Gunnarsson <
> > > > <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I was one of the people criticizing role="text".
> > > > > If you present something as an image to some users you should
> present
> > > > > it to all users.
> > > > > Suppose you feel the need to use a heart icon to express your
> undying
> > > > > love for nacho fries:
> > > > > "I heart nacho fries"
> > > > > ("heart" being an image of a heart"), you chose a certain style /
> > > > approach.
> > > > > You can make it accessible by adding alt="love" if you want the
> > > > > literal meaning or alt="heart" if you want to inform a screen
> reader
> > > > > user that a heart icon stands for love (or, in this case, lust).
> > > > > Yes, the screen reader will add the word "graphics" or "image" to
> the
> > > > > sentence (depending on which one you use). A screen reader user is
> > > > > used to that, it's the standard for how an icon is presented.
> > > > >
> > > > > If you wanted to simply express your love as text you could have
> just
> > > > > written "I love nacho fries". The cognitive load for a screen
> reader
> > > > > user is no greater than that of other users who see text mixed with
> > an
> > > > > image.
> > > > >
> > > > > If you are really worried mark the image as presentational and
> > replace
> > > > > it with a visually hidden text,, or tell your content person that
> > > > > mixing text and images like that can present a problem to screen
> > > > > reader users; possibly others as well, what about users with
> > cognitive
> > > > > impairments, they may benefit or be harmed by this approach.
> > > > > We don't need ARIA to fix what is not really a problem. I have yet
> to
> > > > > see a convincing example where this role can be used for a purpose
> > > > > other than avoiding the word "graphic" to be added by a screen
> > reader.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 7/27/18, Duff Johnson < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> > > > > > Hi Steve,
> > > > > >
> > > > > >>> But role="text" is not a
> > > > > >>> documented role (yet?).
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> It was dumped from ARIA as there was not consensus on how it
> > should
> > > > be
> > > > > >> implemented.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Boo. Hiss. This should get another look.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Or… add an "ActualText" attribute to HTML 5.3.. :-)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Duff.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Work hard. Have fun. Make history.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > >