WebAIM - Web Accessibility In Mind

E-mail List Archives

Re: Longdesc replacement

for

From: Mallory
Date: Apr 13, 2019 3:13AM

I've just been adding links to visible content sitting elsewhere. The places I would have used a longdesc are charts and graphs and things anyway. People other than blind and low-vision can appreciate a deeper textual description. I tell objecting designers to go back to their avocado toast and frappuccinos and let me get stuff done.

This approach avoids pretty much all the longdesc/aria-foobar/polyfill stuff that I'm just too damn old for now. It's straightforward. It's easy for any non-specialist to determine if it broke during any updates. The domain-expert can check the description for accuracy. An automated tool can check for link-rot. It'll work on the oldest, crappiest user agent. Apple can't block it. The sun will rise again tomorrow.

_mallory

On Fri, Apr 12, 2019, at 7:05 PM, John Foliot wrote:
> Hi Khaleel,
>
> So... here's the story, and a proposed path forward.
>
> @longdesc has great utility (and is/was, honestly, a good design and
> pattern), however it was never properly implemented or supported by browser
> vendors, and as such it was never properly used or deployed by content
> creators - a perfect storm of 'yech'.
>
> During the authoring of HTML 5, there were multiple acrimonious
> "discussions" which became quite divisive - with, at one point, @longdesc
> standing in as proxy for how some of the HTML 5 editors were treating
> accessibility issues overall. Standards making at the W3C (as is elsewhere)
> can be a messy business, and the fate of @longdesc was such that while it
> ultimately was 'accepted' to remain as part of the larger HTML 5 spec,
> vendors (and in particular Apple) were very unhappy with that decision,
> resulting in a "Formal Objection" being raised at the W3C. In cases like
> that, the final arbitrator is actually Tim Berners-Lee, who decided to
> let @longdesc remain. Apple in particular however did not like that
> response (arrogant folks that they can be sometimes), and so despite the
> fact that it *should* be a valid attribute, Apple refuses to support it in
> VoiceOver or Safari (which ultimately means it will never work on a Mac /
> iOS device).
>
> During those discussion, Apple proposed lots of other "potential" solutions
> (none of which, 5 years later, are robustly implemented everywhere, so
> thanks for nothing Apple - see: https://cookiecrook.com/longdesc/), with
> perhaps the exception of Standard link inside figure caption
> <https://cookiecrook.com/longdesc/figure_link/>, which most designers have
> rejected as not suitable due to the visual design impact it imposes. One
> other potential solution, to use @details, still does not have universal
> support (see: https://caniuse.com/#searchÞtails) although that can
> probably be corrected using a polyfill (or will change once Edge adopts the
> chromium browser engine). The suggested SVG solutions still do not have
> robust support (and the state of accessible SVG seems to have stalled).
>
> So... today the only real solution that I can see to provide a longer
> description of a complex graphic is to hack around the pattern
> that @details was supposed to deliver natively in the browser (until such
> time as it does). I'll also note that the "example
> <https://cookiecrook.com/longdesc/details/>" provided by James Craig
> (@cookiecrook) isn't really providing a longer textual description, but
> rather just a slightly more verbose @alt text, and I'll further suggest
> that they way he's provided the example would never work for a truly
> complex graphic such as this:
> https://therenegadepharmacist.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/coke1hr3.jpg
>
> Essentially however, I'd propose to create a "drawer" (i.e. an expanding or
> contracting div directly below the image) that would load by default
> collapsed, and in that div provide the longer textual description. The down
> side of this technique however is that it still has a visual imposition on
> the display, which some claim is a "benefit" (but don't have to deal with
> picky graphic designers who might disagree). I've also seen examples where
> verbose longer descriptions have been referenced by aria-describedby, but
> the user-experience there for non-sighted users is sub-optimal, because
> screen readers 'force' that (longer) description on the user (whereas
> the @longdesc attribute suggested that a longer description was available,
> but the user had to explicitly request it) - so I'd be careful about using
> aria-describedby here.
>
> Other possible solutions is to re-use the javascript solution my buddy Dirk
> Ginader wrote for me (
> http://blog.ginader.de/dev/jquery/longdesc/examples/webaim/index.php), or
> (if you are using WordPress) implement Joe Dolson's accessibility plugin
> (see: https://www.joedolson.com/2014/03/update-wp-accessibility-longdesc/),
> which riffs off of Dirk's example. Both of those solutions
> polyfill @longdesc
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> JF
>
> On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 10:59 AM Khaleel Eksheir < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> >
> > I'm writing this email to ask about the use of "longdesc". Based on
> > W3Schools <https://www.w3schools.com/tags/att_img_longdesc.asp>,
> > "longdesc"
> > is not supported by HTML 5 and all browsers. I tested "longdesc" using JAWS
> > with Chrome, Firefox, and IE 11. It did not work with Chrome and Firefox.
> > It worked with IE 11 but was confusing. What would be the replacement? is
> > there a solution? Would a link tag <a> work?
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Khaleel
> >
> >
> > Khaleel Eksheir, MSc.ESM | Assistive Technology Specialist
> > UNC Charlotte | Fretwell 230Q | Office of Disability Services
> > 9201 University City Blvd. | Charlotte, NC 28223
> > Phone: (704) 687-0042 | Fax: (704) 687-1395
> > <EMAIL REMOVED> | Free/Busy Calendar
> > <
> > https://calendar.google.com/calendar/embed?src=keksheir%40uncc.edu&ctz=America/New_York
> > >
> > | http://www.ds.uncc.edu
> >
> >
> > If you are not the intended recipient of this transmission or a person
> > responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, any disclosure,
> > copying, distribution, or other use of any of the information in this
> > transmission is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission
> > in error, please notify me immediately by reply e-mail or by telephone at
> > 704-687-0042. Thank you
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > --------------------------------
> > > > > > > > > >
>
>
> --
> *​John Foliot* | Principal Accessibility Strategist | W3C AC Representative
> Deque Systems - Accessibility for Good
> deque.com
> > > > >