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Re: - AccessiBe! Help!!

for

From: Hayman, Douglass
Date: May 26, 2022 9:48AM

Sandy,

Like Andy mentioned, something that interferes with someone's screen reader creates a bad experience.

We wouldn't propose that a full time user of a customized power wheelchair leave that at the door of a grocery store and instead use that one-sized-suits-all motorized chair in the store. While the customized chair is suited to the person's body, may use head controlled or other navigation, could have left or right handed joystick and so on, screen reader users make choices on a whole variety of things. The idea of making it to this web site without a screen reader and then chancing upon “oh good, they offer a screen reader” is far-fetched. And some of these overlay firms give you the choice to turn such features off or hide them.

Those who rely upon screen readers would likely do something more system-wide if they were without their screen reader like in the case of using somebody else's machine. They might toggle on narrator in Windows or Voiceover on macOS and proceed from there to make do without their preferred assistive technology.

I primarily use Chrome as my web browser and have AccessiByeBy enabled to hide such overlays, only toggling that off to do things like looking at your site with the overlay in action.

It would make more sense to hire a panel of people who use various forms of assistive technology and have them provide feedback on the non-overlay site as to what they would like to see changed to make the site meet their needs.



Doug Hayman
IT Accessibility Coordinator
Information Technology
Olympic College
<EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >
(360) 475-7632



From: WebAIM-Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> > On Behalf Of Sandy Feldman
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 8:34 AM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >; Ryan E. Benson < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: [EXTERNAL] - Re: [WebAIM] AccessiBe! Help!!

CAUTION: This email came from a non-OC system or external source. Beware of phishing and social engineering!


A lot of this site's users use assistive technology. The site owner is a JAWS user. I think examples are key in making the point.

I think if we can show that things are worse we can turn this thing off.
Sandy

sandyfeldman.com<https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fsandyfeldman.com%2F&data%7C01%7Cdhayman%40olympic.edu%7C75a80d01ae9341d3960e08da3f2d3a8d%7C5089378aab1544c0b1bad4f21ccc3085%7C1%7C0%7C637891760733626392%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Vr0PZStHSb2HKdkQ7akwpVnCggo94P7knlWwCyhXK04%3D&reserved=0>
a11yready.com<https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.a11yready.com%2F&data%7C01%7Cdhayman%40olympic.edu%7C75a80d01ae9341d3960e08da3f2d3a8d%7C5089378aab1544c0b1bad4f21ccc3085%7C1%7C0%7C637891760733626392%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=gXNKFs85cYNe%2Fkv3kEuB7r5fwcKEcqa4a83k2EBApKE%3D&reserved=0>

On 2022-05-26 11:20 a.m., Ryan E. Benson wrote:

Unless they understand assistive technology, I'm fearful that examples

would not work. AccessiBe has been in a few lawsuits, so showing that might

be the best way to go about it. Karl groves made his testimony in a case

public.



--

Ryan E. Benson



On Thu, May 26, 2022, 11:04 AM Sandy Feldman < <EMAIL REMOVED> ><mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:



Catherine, thank you.



I have seen those, and passed them along. They aren't helping. What I

really need is examples specific to this site of things going wrong.

Sandy



sandyfeldman.com

a11yready.com <https://www.a11yready.com/><https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.a11yready.com%2F&data%7C01%7Cdhayman%40olympic.edu%7C75a80d01ae9341d3960e08da3f2d3a8d%7C5089378aab1544c0b1bad4f21ccc3085%7C1%7C0%7C637891760733626392%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=gXNKFs85cYNe%2Fkv3kEuB7r5fwcKEcqa4a83k2EBApKE%3D&reserved=0>





On 2022-05-26 10:57 a.m., Catherine Roy wrote:



Hi Sandy,



Have you seen these resources?



https://overlayfactsheet.com/<https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Foverlayfactsheet.com%2F&data%7C01%7Cdhayman%40olympic.edu%7C75a80d01ae9341d3960e08da3f2d3a8d%7C5089378aab1544c0b1bad4f21ccc3085%7C1%7C0%7C637891760733626392%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=ru5RXmriDZj9ADS0MFEynXblPnvOM37trOvo1DtcFwU%3D&reserved=0>



https://accessibleweb.com/web-accessibility-news/do-away-with-overlays/<https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Faccessibleweb.com%2Fweb-accessibility-news%2Fdo-away-with-overlays%2F&data%7C01%7Cdhayman%40olympic.edu%7C75a80d01ae9341d3960e08da3f2d3a8d%7C5089378aab1544c0b1bad4f21ccc3085%7C1%7C0%7C637891760733626392%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=XrbjFUG7WhcY7atZkGoda8N8SjkBJsP54XPBSjnWGn0%3D&reserved=0>





https://www.essentialaccessibility.com/blog/the-many-pitfalls-of-accessibility-overlays<https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.essentialaccessibility.com%2Fblog%2Fthe-many-pitfalls-of-accessibility-overlays&data%7C01%7Cdhayman%40olympic.edu%7C75a80d01ae9341d3960e08da3f2d3a8d%7C5089378aab1544c0b1bad4f21ccc3085%7C1%7C0%7C637891760733626392%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=IiXT0%2FCL9ITT%2Fia%2BayR%2F3O3FYHMjC3QXGuisRTrVFZ4%3D&reserved=0>



HTH,

Catherine



--

Catherine Roy

www.catherine-roy.net<;https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.catherine-roy.net%2F&data%7C01%7Cdhayman%40olympic.edu%7C75a80d01ae9341d3960e08da3f2d3a8d%7C5089378aab1544c0b1bad4f21ccc3085%7C1%7C0%7C637891760733626392%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=AweFinZyvTRm%2BWM0mNru4Yn1tnyNRj4g90M8hevWeHE%3D&reserved=0>



On May 26, 2022, at 10:46 AM, Nathan Clark < <EMAIL REMOVED> ><mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >

< <EMAIL REMOVED> ><mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:



Dear Sandy,

That should not be to difficult knowing how bad their overlay thing works.



Sincerely,

Nathan Clark





On 5/26/22, Sandy Feldman < <EMAIL REMOVED> ><mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >

< <EMAIL REMOVED> ><mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:



Nate, thanks - but it didn't work! We need to provide actual examples from



the site.





Sandy





sandyfeldman.com



a11yready.com









On 2022-05-26 10:16 a.m., Nathan Clark wrote:





Just tell them that disability rights organizations like the National



Federation of the Blind have spoken out against Accessibee and they



don't suggest any company using them.





Nate





On 5/26/22, Sandy Feldman < <EMAIL REMOVED> ><mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >

< <EMAIL REMOVED> ><mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:





hey all,





I'd really appreciate your help with this.





A client has been pressured into adding AccessiBe to their site



imagemd.org/





We have a version without the overlay dev.imagemd.org/. What I'm hoping



is



you guys find things AccessiBe makes worse and we can justify disabling



it.





Thank you so much!





--



Sandy





sandyfeldman.com



a11yready.com





















--

Nathan Clark

QA Automation Analyst Tech team

Accessibility assistant

CPACC

cell: 410-446-7259

email: <EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> >

101 Village Blvd

Princeton, NJ 08540

SMBE & Minority Owned Business