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Thread: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
Number of posts in this thread: 10 (In chronological order)
From: Lynn Holdsworth
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 4:34AM
Subject: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
No previous message | Next message →
Hi all,
This is more of a rant than a question.
I'm feeling totally disempowered and unequal today. I've been asked to
audit a site that doesn't work in IE (it has a cross-domain login
issue), so thought I'd jump ship to Firefox and audit it in there.
It's a very visual site with lots of inaccessible widgets, and I'd
usually use the JAWS cursor to find out what's where and what the
current value is if possible.
But it doesn't work in Firefox.
I searched the web and changed some values in about:config and in FF's
advanced settings, to no avail.
Enter Google Chrome!
The JAWS cursor doesn't work in that browser either.
So I'm having to pay someone with eyesight to help me identify and
describe issues on the site.
That's all. Just feeling as though a previously levelling
playing-field has been whipped out from under my feet.
Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing.
Thanks for listening!
Best, Lynn
From: Asa Baylus
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 4:48AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
You might try Chrome Vox with Chrome
http://www.chromevox.com
Asa
Sent from my iPad
> On Feb 5, 2015, at 6:34 AM, Lynn Holdsworth < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> This is more of a rant than a question.
>
> I'm feeling totally disempowered and unequal today. I've been asked to
> audit a site that doesn't work in IE (it has a cross-domain login
> issue), so thought I'd jump ship to Firefox and audit it in there.
>
> It's a very visual site with lots of inaccessible widgets, and I'd
> usually use the JAWS cursor to find out what's where and what the
> current value is if possible.
>
> But it doesn't work in Firefox.
>
> I searched the web and changed some values in about:config and in FF's
> advanced settings, to no avail.
>
> Enter Google Chrome!
>
> The JAWS cursor doesn't work in that browser either.
>
> So I'm having to pay someone with eyesight to help me identify and
> describe issues on the site.
>
> That's all. Just feeling as though a previously levelling
> playing-field has been whipped out from under my feet.
>
> Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing.
>
> Thanks for listening!
>
> Best, Lynn
> > >
From: Léonie Watson
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 5:02AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
" Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing."
Unfortunately it's been this way with Jaws and Firefox for several versions
of both the browser and the screen reader. It has to do with the graphics
engine Mozilla uses in Firefox I think.
Chrome isn't officially supported by Jaws, so I'm not sure there's any
expectation that the Jaws cursor should work there.
FS is aware of the Firefox problem. Please contact them to let them know
you're finding it a problem though - as with all software and bugs, the more
people that raise the issue the better.
Léonie.
--
@LeonieWatson Tink.UK Carpe diem
> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto:webaim-forum-
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Lynn Holdsworth
> Sent: 05 February 2015 11:34
> To: WebAIM Discussion List
> Subject: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>
> Hi all,
>
> This is more of a rant than a question.
>
> I'm feeling totally disempowered and unequal today. I've been asked to
> audit a site that doesn't work in IE (it has a cross-domain login issue),
so
> thought I'd jump ship to Firefox and audit it in there.
>
> It's a very visual site with lots of inaccessible widgets, and I'd usually
use the
> JAWS cursor to find out what's where and what the current value is if
> possible.
>
> But it doesn't work in Firefox.
>
> I searched the web and changed some values in about:config and in FF's
> advanced settings, to no avail.
>
> Enter Google Chrome!
>
> The JAWS cursor doesn't work in that browser either.
>
> So I'm having to pay someone with eyesight to help me identify and
describe
> issues on the site.
>
> That's all. Just feeling as though a previously levelling playing-field
has been
> whipped out from under my feet.
>
> Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing.
>
> Thanks for listening!
>
> Best, Lynn
> > > messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
From: Lynn Holdsworth
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 6:10AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
Thanks guys.
Asa: ChromeVox doesn't offer the kind of position-based screen review
capability that I need. Thanks for suggesting it anyhow - it was worth
a try.
Leoni: I'll certainly add my voice to those that have already
contacted FS about this issue. It's impacting my job and I'd love them
forever if they could come up with a solution.
I just tried NVDA, whose documentation says it has a review mode, but
frustratingly I couldn't get it to work.
Thanks as always, Lynn
On 05/02/2015, Léonie Watson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> " Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing."
>
> Unfortunately it's been this way with Jaws and Firefox for several versions
> of both the browser and the screen reader. It has to do with the graphics
> engine Mozilla uses in Firefox I think.
>
>
> Chrome isn't officially supported by Jaws, so I'm not sure there's any
> expectation that the Jaws cursor should work there.
>
> FS is aware of the Firefox problem. Please contact them to let them know
> you're finding it a problem though - as with all software and bugs, the
> more
> people that raise the issue the better.
>
> Léonie.
> --
> @LeonieWatson Tink.UK Carpe diem
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto:webaim-forum-
>> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Lynn Holdsworth
>> Sent: 05 February 2015 11:34
>> To: WebAIM Discussion List
>> Subject: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> This is more of a rant than a question.
>>
>> I'm feeling totally disempowered and unequal today. I've been asked to
>> audit a site that doesn't work in IE (it has a cross-domain login issue),
> so
>> thought I'd jump ship to Firefox and audit it in there.
>>
>> It's a very visual site with lots of inaccessible widgets, and I'd
>> usually
> use the
>> JAWS cursor to find out what's where and what the current value is if
>> possible.
>>
>> But it doesn't work in Firefox.
>>
>> I searched the web and changed some values in about:config and in FF's
>> advanced settings, to no avail.
>>
>> Enter Google Chrome!
>>
>> The JAWS cursor doesn't work in that browser either.
>>
>> So I'm having to pay someone with eyesight to help me identify and
> describe
>> issues on the site.
>>
>> That's all. Just feeling as though a previously levelling playing-field
> has been
>> whipped out from under my feet.
>>
>> Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
>> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing.
>>
>> Thanks for listening!
>>
>> Best, Lynn
>> >> >> messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
>
> > > >
From: Jonathan C. Cohn
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 7:29AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
Try the touch cursor. There was also a long discussion on jaws scripting list last week.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 5, 2015, at 8:10 AM, Lynn Holdsworth < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Thanks guys.
>
> Asa: ChromeVox doesn't offer the kind of position-based screen review
> capability that I need. Thanks for suggesting it anyhow - it was worth
> a try.
>
> Leoni: I'll certainly add my voice to those that have already
> contacted FS about this issue. It's impacting my job and I'd love them
> forever if they could come up with a solution.
>
> I just tried NVDA, whose documentation says it has a review mode, but
> frustratingly I couldn't get it to work.
>
> Thanks as always, Lynn
>
>> On 05/02/2015, Léonie Watson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>> " Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
>> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing."
>>
>> Unfortunately it's been this way with Jaws and Firefox for several versions
>> of both the browser and the screen reader. It has to do with the graphics
>> engine Mozilla uses in Firefox I think.
>>
>>
>> Chrome isn't officially supported by Jaws, so I'm not sure there's any
>> expectation that the Jaws cursor should work there.
>>
>> FS is aware of the Firefox problem. Please contact them to let them know
>> you're finding it a problem though - as with all software and bugs, the
>> more
>> people that raise the issue the better.
>>
>> Léonie.
>> --
>> @LeonieWatson Tink.UK Carpe diem
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto:webaim-forum-
>>> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Lynn Holdsworth
>>> Sent: 05 February 2015 11:34
>>> To: WebAIM Discussion List
>>> Subject: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> This is more of a rant than a question.
>>>
>>> I'm feeling totally disempowered and unequal today. I've been asked to
>>> audit a site that doesn't work in IE (it has a cross-domain login issue),
>> so
>>> thought I'd jump ship to Firefox and audit it in there.
>>>
>>> It's a very visual site with lots of inaccessible widgets, and I'd
>>> usually
>> use the
>>> JAWS cursor to find out what's where and what the current value is if
>>> possible.
>>>
>>> But it doesn't work in Firefox.
>>>
>>> I searched the web and changed some values in about:config and in FF's
>>> advanced settings, to no avail.
>>>
>>> Enter Google Chrome!
>>>
>>> The JAWS cursor doesn't work in that browser either.
>>>
>>> So I'm having to pay someone with eyesight to help me identify and
>> describe
>>> issues on the site.
>>>
>>> That's all. Just feeling as though a previously levelling playing-field
>> has been
>>> whipped out from under my feet.
>>>
>>> Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
>>> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing.
>>>
>>> Thanks for listening!
>>>
>>> Best, Lynn
>>> >>> >>> messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
>>
>> >> >> >>
> > >
From: _mallory
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 8:01AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
Hm, if the site is so inaccessible that the accessiblity tester can't
even test it, isn't that right there an automatic fail?
I mean, would they expect general users to use the cursor to find
stuff? Or is it more so you can point specifically to "area x with
these words" to the developers?
_mallory
From: Léonie Watson
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 7:46AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
" Hm, if the site is so inaccessible that the accessiblity tester can't even
test it, isn't that right there an automatic fail?"
Needing the Jaws cursor isn't necessarily a sign of inaccessibility. You use
it to move the mouse pointer over specific objects in the UI, so you can do
things like ascertain the colours being used, or pull up the context menu to
open tools like Firebug etc.
It can also be used when you need to simulate mouse interaction because
there is no keyboard support available of course.
Léonie.
--
@LeonieWatson Tink.UK Carpe diem
> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto:webaim-forum-
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of _mallory
> Sent: 05 February 2015 15:02
> To: WebAIM Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>
> Hm, if the site is so inaccessible that the accessiblity tester can't even
test it,
> isn't that right there an automatic fail?
>
> I mean, would they expect general users to use the cursor to find stuff?
Or is
> it more so you can point specifically to "area x with these words" to the
> developers?
>
> _mallory
> > > messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
From: Jonathan Avila
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 8:05AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
I've also used the touch cursor under Windows 7 is apps to show where the focus is and to check reading order and object structure. I'm not sure if t will be useful on webpages or not. JAWS also has a really helpful keystroke for checking the current web page element in VC mode, it is control shift insert f1.
Jonathan
> On Feb 5, 2015, at 9:30 AM, Jonathan C. Cohn < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Try the touch cursor. There was also a long discussion on jaws scripting list last week.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Feb 5, 2015, at 8:10 AM, Lynn Holdsworth < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>
>> Thanks guys.
>>
>> Asa: ChromeVox doesn't offer the kind of position-based screen review
>> capability that I need. Thanks for suggesting it anyhow - it was worth
>> a try.
>>
>> Leoni: I'll certainly add my voice to those that have already
>> contacted FS about this issue. It's impacting my job and I'd love them
>> forever if they could come up with a solution.
>>
>> I just tried NVDA, whose documentation says it has a review mode, but
>> frustratingly I couldn't get it to work.
>>
>> Thanks as always, Lynn
>>
>>> On 05/02/2015, Léonie Watson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>> " Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
>>> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing."
>>>
>>> Unfortunately it's been this way with Jaws and Firefox for several versions
>>> of both the browser and the screen reader. It has to do with the graphics
>>> engine Mozilla uses in Firefox I think.
>>>
>>>
>>> Chrome isn't officially supported by Jaws, so I'm not sure there's any
>>> expectation that the Jaws cursor should work there.
>>>
>>> FS is aware of the Firefox problem. Please contact them to let them know
>>> you're finding it a problem though - as with all software and bugs, the
>>> more
>>> people that raise the issue the better.
>>>
>>> Léonie.
>>> --
>>> @LeonieWatson Tink.UK Carpe diem
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto:webaim-forum-
>>>> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Lynn Holdsworth
>>>> Sent: 05 February 2015 11:34
>>>> To: WebAIM Discussion List
>>>> Subject: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> This is more of a rant than a question.
>>>>
>>>> I'm feeling totally disempowered and unequal today. I've been asked to
>>>> audit a site that doesn't work in IE (it has a cross-domain login issue),
>>> so
>>>> thought I'd jump ship to Firefox and audit it in there.
>>>>
>>>> It's a very visual site with lots of inaccessible widgets, and I'd
>>>> usually
>>> use the
>>>> JAWS cursor to find out what's where and what the current value is if
>>>> possible.
>>>>
>>>> But it doesn't work in Firefox.
>>>>
>>>> I searched the web and changed some values in about:config and in FF's
>>>> advanced settings, to no avail.
>>>>
>>>> Enter Google Chrome!
>>>>
>>>> The JAWS cursor doesn't work in that browser either.
>>>>
>>>> So I'm having to pay someone with eyesight to help me identify and
>>> describe
>>>> issues on the site.
>>>>
>>>> That's all. Just feeling as though a previously levelling playing-field
>>> has been
>>>> whipped out from under my feet.
>>>>
>>>> Obviously if anyone has a solution I'd love to hear it. But I've spent
>>>> 3 hours this morning searching, tweaking, restarting and failing.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for listening!
>>>>
>>>> Best, Lynn
>>>> >>>> >>>> messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
>>>
>>> >>> >>> >> >> >> > > >
From: Ron Stewart
Date: Thu, Feb 05 2015 12:30PM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | Next message →
On the inverse a sites functionality with JAWS also does not insure that the
site is accessible. JAWS is a very powerful and very expensive software
program, that can brute force its way through accessibility errors in a
site. For the visually impaired I actually recommend you do your testing
with NVDA, Voiceover and perhaps CromeVox. You also need to insure the site
will work for other users of assistive technology such as Voice Recognition
users and users of alternative input devices. The first step is to insure
that the site is WCAG 2.0 AA compliant but also that it is tested by actual
users of AT.
I have reviewed quite a variety of sites that worked with a screen reader,
but when colors were inverted such as for a low vision user significant
portions of the content disappeared. Or that they could be effectively
navigated by someone with a sensory disability but a user with mobility
issues could not effectively navigate the site with their voice or their
screen based keyboard.
Ron Stewart
-----Original Message-----
From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
[mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Léonie Watson
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2015 8:46 AM
To: 'WebAIM Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
" Hm, if the site is so inaccessible that the accessiblity tester can't even
test it, isn't that right there an automatic fail?"
Needing the Jaws cursor isn't necessarily a sign of inaccessibility. You use
it to move the mouse pointer over specific objects in the UI, so you can do
things like ascertain the colours being used, or pull up the context menu to
open tools like Firebug etc.
It can also be used when you need to simulate mouse interaction because
there is no keyboard support available of course.
Léonie.
--
@LeonieWatson Tink.UK Carpe diem
> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto:webaim-forum-
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of _mallory
> Sent: 05 February 2015 15:02
> To: WebAIM Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>
> Hm, if the site is so inaccessible that the accessiblity tester can't
> even
test it,
> isn't that right there an automatic fail?
>
> I mean, would they expect general users to use the cursor to find stuff?
Or is
> it more so you can point specifically to "area x with these words" to
> the developers?
>
> _mallory
> > > list messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
From: Lynn Holdsworth
Date: Fri, Feb 06 2015 2:47AM
Subject: Re: JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
← Previous message | No next message
Thanks for your comment Ron. The site will be tested using various AT
and browser combinations. However, being blind I need to choose a
screenreader with which to do the bulk of the testing (my day job),
and JAWS is my screenreader of choice. I'm aware of the extra
accessibility hacks it introduces, and I constantly examine the markup
to compensate for this.
Best, Lynn
On 05/02/2015, Ron Stewart < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> On the inverse a sites functionality with JAWS also does not insure that
> the
> site is accessible. JAWS is a very powerful and very expensive software
> program, that can brute force its way through accessibility errors in a
> site. For the visually impaired I actually recommend you do your testing
> with NVDA, Voiceover and perhaps CromeVox. You also need to insure the site
> will work for other users of assistive technology such as Voice Recognition
> users and users of alternative input devices. The first step is to insure
> that the site is WCAG 2.0 AA compliant but also that it is tested by actual
> users of AT.
>
> I have reviewed quite a variety of sites that worked with a screen reader,
> but when colors were inverted such as for a low vision user significant
> portions of the content disappeared. Or that they could be effectively
> navigated by someone with a sensory disability but a user with mobility
> issues could not effectively navigate the site with their voice or their
> screen based keyboard.
>
> Ron Stewart
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
> [mailto: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of Léonie Watson
> Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2015 8:46 AM
> To: 'WebAIM Discussion List'
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>
> " Hm, if the site is so inaccessible that the accessiblity tester can't
> even
> test it, isn't that right there an automatic fail?"
>
> Needing the Jaws cursor isn't necessarily a sign of inaccessibility. You
> use
> it to move the mouse pointer over specific objects in the UI, so you can do
> things like ascertain the colours being used, or pull up the context menu
> to
> open tools like Firebug etc.
>
> It can also be used when you need to simulate mouse interaction because
> there is no keyboard support available of course.
>
> Léonie.
> --
> @LeonieWatson Tink.UK Carpe diem
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = [mailto:webaim-forum-
>> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = ] On Behalf Of _mallory
>> Sent: 05 February 2015 15:02
>> To: WebAIM Discussion List
>> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] JAWS cursor doesn't work in Firefox or Chrome
>>
>> Hm, if the site is so inaccessible that the accessiblity tester can't
>> even
> test it,
>> isn't that right there an automatic fail?
>>
>> I mean, would they expect general users to use the cursor to find stuff?
> Or is
>> it more so you can point specifically to "area x with these words" to
>> the developers?
>>
>> _mallory
>> >> >> list messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
>
> > > messages to = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED =
>
>
> > > >