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Thread: Scalable or Responsive and why
Number of posts in this thread: 12 (In chronological order)
From: Szaj, Julie
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 12:09PM
Subject: Scalable or Responsive and why
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Hello Everyone,
There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay=
to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. =
I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Argum=
ents for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the clien=
t, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hea=
r your honest thoughts.
Julie
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From: Jonathan Avila
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 12:12PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
Responsive is much better for users with low vision so they do not have to scroll horizontally to read a line of text. It would also likely be needed to meet WCAG 2.1 SC 1.4.10 which indicates text should fit into a width of 320CSS pixels without scrolling in the direction of the text.
Jonathan
-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of Szaj, Julie
Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2020 2:09 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why
CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.
Hello Everyone,
There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
Julie
[signature]
The materials in this message are private and may contain Protected Healthcare Information or other information of a sensitive nature. If you are not the intended recipient, be advised that any unauthorized use, disclosure, copying or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately notify the sender via telephone or return mail.
From: Aditya
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 12:44PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
Responsive rearranges content blocks. Example, a list of links that are horizontally laid out would go under a hamburger menu when page is zoomed and users would have to navigate again to re orient and access content.
I guess it's picking what's best for your users.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 8, 2020, at 1:12 PM, Jonathan Avila < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Responsive is much better for users with low vision so they do not have to scroll horizontally to read a line of text. It would also likely be needed to meet WCAG 2.1 SC 1.4.10 which indicates text should fit into a width of 320CSS pixels without scrolling in the direction of the text.
>
> Jonathan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of Szaj, Julie
> Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2020 2:09 PM
> To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> Subject: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.
>
>
> Hello Everyone,
>
> There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
>
> Julie
>
> [signature]
>
>
> > The materials in this message are private and may contain Protected Healthcare Information or other information of a sensitive nature. If you are not the intended recipient, be advised that any unauthorized use, disclosure, copying or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately notify the sender via telephone or return mail.
> > > >
From: Swift, Daniel P.
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 12:48PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
Going responsive makes obvious sense to me. The trend now is consuming content wherever you are and mobile devices aren't going anywhere ... I believe that this is a bridge that you will need to cross eventually. Up until about a year or 2 ago, our LMS was not mobile friendly at all and students were far from happy.
Do you have analytics on how your content is accessed? If possible, you can use that to make your argument.
Good luck!
Daniel Swift, MBA
Senior Web Specialist
University Communications and Marketing
West Chester University
610.738.0589
-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of Szaj, Julie
Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2020 2:09 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why
Hello Everyone,
There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
Julie
[signature]
The materials in this message are private and may contain Protected Healthcare Information or other information of a sensitive nature. If you are not the intended recipient, be advised that any unauthorized use, disclosure, copying or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately notify the sender via telephone or return mail.
From: Patrick H. Lauke
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 1:34PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
On 08/10/2020 19:09, Szaj, Julie wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
>
> There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
What exactly is a "scalable" site rather than a responsive one?
--
Patrick H. Lauke
https://www.splintered.co.uk/ | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
https://flickr.com/photos/redux/ | https://www.deviantart.com/redux
twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
From: Aditya
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 2:34PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
Scalable, as I understand it, does not rearrange content. The relative positions are maintained. Or you can say that the content goes out of bounds of screen and users have to scroll to get content.
Responsive reacts to the view port and rearranges itself.
There might be a technical definition somewhere but that what I have observed.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 8, 2020, at 2:34 PM, Patrick H. Lauke < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
>> On 08/10/2020 19:09, Szaj, Julie wrote:
>> Hello Everyone,
>> There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
>
> What exactly is a "scalable" site rather than a responsive one?
>
> --
> Patrick H. Lauke
>
> https://www.splintered.co.uk/ | https://github.com/patrickhlauke
> https://flickr.com/photos/redux/ | https://www.deviantart.com/redux
> twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
> > > >
From: glen walker
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 2:46PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
That just sounds like responsive and non-responsive.
Scalable is usually used in terms of volume. If you have a web app that
can handle a handful of users but crashes when more people connect, it's
not scalable.
So I think Patrick's clarifying question was trying to understand how
"scalable" ties in with accessibility with the original question. An app
being scalable vs responsive is not really the correct comparison since
they're separate things.
On Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 2:36 PM Aditya via WebAIM-Forum <
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Scalable, as I understand it, does not rearrange content. The relative
> positions are maintained. Or you can say that the content goes out of
> bounds of screen and users have to scroll to get content.
>
> Responsive reacts to the view port and rearranges itself.
>
> There might be a technical definition somewhere but that what I have
> observed.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Oct 8, 2020, at 2:34 PM, Patrick H. Lauke < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> wrote:
> >
> > What exactly is a "scalable" site rather than a responsive one?
> >
> > --
> > Patrick H. Lauke
> >
>
From: Aditya
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 4:20PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
Glen,
The term "scalable" is in reference to the html (like Max-scale and initial-scale).
The scalability you are referring to infrastructure related.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 8, 2020, at 3:46 PM, glen walker < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> That just sounds like responsive and non-responsive.
>
> Scalable is usually used in terms of volume. If you have a web app that
> can handle a handful of users but crashes when more people connect, it's
> not scalable.
>
> So I think Patrick's clarifying question was trying to understand how
> "scalable" ties in with accessibility with the original question. An app
> being scalable vs responsive is not really the correct comparison since
> they're separate things.
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 2:36 PM Aditya via WebAIM-Forum <
> = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
>> Scalable, as I understand it, does not rearrange content. The relative
>> positions are maintained. Or you can say that the content goes out of
>> bounds of screen and users have to scroll to get content.
>>
>> Responsive reacts to the view port and rearranges itself.
>>
>> There might be a technical definition somewhere but that what I have
>> observed.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Oct 8, 2020, at 2:34 PM, Patrick H. Lauke < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> What exactly is a "scalable" site rather than a responsive one?
>>>
>>> --
>>> Patrick H. Lauke
>>>
>>
> > > >
From: glen walker
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 5:14PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
Ah, so like pinch and zoom scalable.
On Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 4:22 PM Aditya via WebAIM-Forum <
= EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Glen,
>
> The term "scalable" is in reference to the html (like Max-scale and
> initial-scale).
>
> The scalability you are referring to infrastructure related.
>
>
>
From: Vaughn, Michael
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 7:31PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
Perhaps youre talking about Adobe Captivate output (uses <canvas> elements). Like this (sorry, I think the play button is not keyboard-operable):
https://community-portal-prod-previewdata.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/files/2020/08/2139ef2e658ec52ef9a1/index.html
It scales to fit the viewport, so resize the window and youll see what the scaling is all about. Try to do a page zoom and be prepared to be frustrated.
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Date: Thursday, October 8, 2020 at 4:36 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Cc: Aditya < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why
Scalable, as I understand it, does not rearrange content. The relative positions are maintained. Or you can say that the content goes out of bounds of screen and users have to scroll to get content.
Responsive reacts to the view port and rearranges itself.
There might be a technical definition somewhere but that what I have observed.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 8, 2020, at 2:34 PM, Patrick H. Lauke < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
>> On 08/10/2020 19:09, Szaj, Julie wrote:
>> Hello Everyone,
>> There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
>
> What exactly is a "scalable" site rather than a responsive one?
>
> --
> Patrick H. Lauke
>
> https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.splintered.co.uk%2F&data=02%7C01%7Cmichael.vaughn%40yale.edu%7C6b0e0e25f8d54339a0ba08d86bc9d02b%7Cdd8cbebb21394df8b4114e3e87abeb5c%7C0%7C0%7C637377861813610718&sdata=65Dtc6OIX6ca4zl3ClWt%2Bfc79vc3xzmn0CDzDQJ5vhU%3D&reserved=0 | https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fpatrickhlauke&data=02%7C01%7Cmichael.vaughn%40yale.edu%7C6b0e0e25f8d54339a0ba08d86bc9d02b%7Cdd8cbebb21394df8b4114e3e87abeb5c%7C0%7C0%7C637377861813610718&sdata=90g9t25tNSvbwgUhq5zOUm%2BtYTfEdmY%2BMmPCq286e08%3D&reserved=0
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> twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
> > > >
From: Steve Green
Date: Thu, Oct 08 2020 7:49PM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | Next message →
The e-learning modules output by Articulate also scale to fit the viewport. It doesn't use <canvas> elements, but almost everything you see is an SVG (including all the text, buttons, form controls etc.). The content actually gets smaller as you increase the zoom level, presumably because the whitespace around the content gets bigger, effectively reducing the viewport size.
Steve Green
Managing Director
Test Partners Ltd
-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of Vaughn, Michael
Sent: 09 October 2020 02:32
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why
Perhaps you're talking about Adobe Captivate output (uses <canvas> elements). Like this (sorry, I think the play button is not keyboard-operable):
https://community-portal-prod-previewdata.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/files/2020/08/2139ef2e658ec52ef9a1/index.html
It scales to fit the viewport, so resize the window and you'll see what the "scaling" is all about. Try to do a page zoom and be prepared to be frustrated.
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Date: Thursday, October 8, 2020 at 4:36 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Cc: Aditya < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why Scalable, as I understand it, does not rearrange content. The relative positions are maintained. Or you can say that the content goes out of bounds of screen and users have to scroll to get content.
Responsive reacts to the view port and rearranges itself.
There might be a technical definition somewhere but that what I have observed.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 8, 2020, at 2:34 PM, Patrick H. Lauke < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
>> On 08/10/2020 19:09, Szaj, Julie wrote:
>> Hello Everyone,
>> There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
>
> What exactly is a "scalable" site rather than a responsive one?
>
> --
> Patrick H. Lauke
>
> https://nam05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.
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From: Szaj, Julie
Date: Mon, Oct 12 2020 9:52AM
Subject: Re: Scalable or Responsive and why
← Previous message | No next message
Thank you everyone for your thoughts and comments.
One of our teams that makes the decisions requiring content to be scalable vs responsive is going to keep the responsive design requirement. We use Adobe Captivate and have decided to create some templates that content creators could use if they choose. Unfortunately we have no support for content creators who use the software, so we are hoping some simple, branded templates would help.
Julie
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Green < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2020 8:50 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why
The e-learning modules output by Articulate also scale to fit the viewport. It doesn't use <canvas> elements, but almost everything you see is an SVG (including all the text, buttons, form controls etc.). The content actually gets smaller as you increase the zoom level, presumably because the whitespace around the content gets bigger, effectively reducing the viewport size.
Steve Green
Managing Director
Test Partners Ltd
-----Original Message-----
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > On Behalf Of Vaughn, Michael
Sent: 09 October 2020 02:32
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why
Perhaps you're talking about Adobe Captivate output (uses <canvas> elements). Like this (sorry, I think the play button is not keyboard-operable):
https://community-portal-prod-previewdata.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/files/2020/08/2139ef2e658ec52ef9a1/index.html
It scales to fit the viewport, so resize the window and you'll see what the "scaling" is all about. Try to do a page zoom and be prepared to be frustrated.
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Date: Thursday, October 8, 2020 at 4:36 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Cc: Aditya < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Scalable or Responsive and why Scalable, as I understand it, does not rearrange content. The relative positions are maintained. Or you can say that the content goes out of bounds of screen and users have to scroll to get content.
Responsive reacts to the view port and rearranges itself.
There might be a technical definition somewhere but that what I have observed.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 8, 2020, at 2:34 PM, Patrick H. Lauke < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
>> On 08/10/2020 19:09, Szaj, Julie wrote:
>> Hello Everyone,
>> There is discussion happening at my university regarding whether it is okay to create online training content that is scalable instead of responsive. I believe they should be responsive because they are more accessible. Arguments for scalable are they are faster to create, thus cheaper for the client, and are "less frustrating" for the content creators. I would love to hear your honest thoughts.
>
> What exactly is a "scalable" site rather than a responsive one?
>
> --
> Patrick H. Lauke
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