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Re: <select multiple> and WCAG compliance
From: Jonathan Cohn
Date: Oct 24, 2017 11:58AM
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I verified that the multi-elect option in MacOS Safari under El Capitan
10.11 correctly handles <select multiple> when the keystroke vo key plus
command plus return is pressed. In older MacOs, I believe this key
combination either did not exist or else did not disable cursor tracking
causing moves in the VO cursor to also change selection.
In the MacOs running 10.11 - 10.13 when the multi-select key combination
mentioned above is activated then selection stops following the voice over
cursor allowing multiple selection to work correctly with out first
disabling cursor tracking.
Let me know if you need me to check with other Macintosh browsers.
Jonathan Cohn
On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 10:10 AM Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
wrote:
> You can log webkit bugs at the address below. I believe you may need to
> create an account to the log the bug.
> http://webkit.org/new-ax-bug
>
> Jonathan
>
> Jonathan Avila
> Chief Accessibility Officer
> Level Access, inc. (formerly SSB BART Group, inc.)
> <EMAIL REMOVED>
> 703.637.8957 <(703)%20637-8957> (Office)
> Visit us online: Website | Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Blog
> Looking to boost your accessibility knowledge? Check out our free webinars!
>
> The information contained in this transmission may be attorney privileged
> and/or confidential information intended for the use of the individual or
> entity named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended
> recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
> distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
> Behalf Of Roel Van Gils
> Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 10:05 AM
> To: WebAIM Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] <select multiple> and WCAG compliance
>
> Thanks all. Very informative.
>
> I knew about multi-select in Firefox, but Shift+F8 in IE / Edge was
> completely new to me.
>
> If Chrome and Safari are indeed the only browsers there are lacking
> support, I'd like to file a bug report / feature request.
>
> (I think it might even be possible to mimic the Firefox behaviour in other
> browsers using scripting.)
>
> Roel
>
> > On 24 Oct 2017, at 15:50, Sailesh Panchang < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> wrote:
> >
> > I echo Jonathan's experience.
> > Also hold the control key as one goes up and down with arrow keys and
> > use space to select/deselect.
> > Thanks,
> > Sailesh
> >
> >
> > On 10/24/17, Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> > wrote:
> >>> I have been able to select non-contiguous options using Firefox but
> >>> I have not been able to do so using Chrome or Internet Explorer. Has
> >>> anyone been able to do so in either of those browsers?
> >>
> >> I've been using shift+f8 for multiselect in IE since 1999. It's a
> >> well-documented keystrokes to select non-contiguous items.
> >>
> >> Jonathan
> >>
> >> Jonathan Avila
> >> Chief Accessibility Officer
> >> Level Access, inc. (formerly SSB BART Group, inc.)
> >> <EMAIL REMOVED>
> >> 703.637.8957 <(703)%20637-8957> (Office)
> >> Visit us online: Website | Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Blog
> >> Looking to boost your accessibility knowledge? Check out our free
> webinars!
> >>
> >> The information contained in this transmission may be attorney
> >> privileged and/or confidential information intended for the use of
> >> the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this message
> >> is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use,
> >> dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is
> strictly prohibited.
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: WebAIM-Forum [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ] On
> >> Behalf Of Steve Green
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 8:24 AM
> >> To: WebAIM Discussion List
> >> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] <select multiple> and WCAG compliance
> >>
> >> My view is that if it doesn't work in all the major browsers, then
> >> it's a WCAG non-compliance even if the code is HTML
> >> standards-compliant. That particular WCAG success criterion does not
> >> require the HTML to be compliant
> >> - it requires the feature to be keyboard accessible, which it isn't.
> >>
> >> I have been able to select non-contiguous options using Firefox but I
> >> have not been able to do so using Chrome or Internet Explorer. Has
> >> anyone been able to do so in either of those browsers?
> >>
> >> There is another, perhaps bigger, issue. When returning to a page
> >> containing a multi-select combobox, the user does not know it is
> >> multi-select. If they give focus to it without holding down the
> >> necessary modifier key (which seems to be different in each browser)
> >> all the selected options will become unselected. There would
> >> therefore need to be some text explaining this (and the need for text
> >> explaining how your UI works is usually a clue it's a bad design).
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> Steve Green
> >> Managing Director
> >> Test Partners Ltd
> >>
> >> > >> From: WebAIM-Forum < <EMAIL REMOVED> > on behalf
> >> of Roel Van Gils < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
> >> Sent: 24 October 2017 12:47
> >> To: WebAIM Discussion List
> >> Subject: [WebAIM] <select multiple> and WCAG compliance
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I consider using `<select multiple>` (see example below) a very poor
> >> practice in terms of accessibility (and usability in general). I
> >> usually suggest using a series of checkboxes instead.
> >>
> >> <select multiple>
> >> <option value="volvo">Volvo</option> <option
> >> value="saab">Saab</option> <option value="opel">Opel</option>
> >> <option value="audi">Audi</option> </select>
> >>
> >> Most users don't know they have to hold down a modifier key
> >> (dependent on the OS they're using) to select more than items, and
> >> even if even they know (or tell them), it's hard for certain users to
> >> operate the keyboard and the mouse at the same time. Without a mouse,
> >> I believe that's not even possible in most browsers.
> >>
> >> Screenreader support is also spotty, but it's possible (if you try
> >> hard enough).
> >>
> >> My question is: is it acceptable to let a website fail for WCAG 2.1.1
> >> ('Make all functionality available from a keyboard') when the author
> >> uses perfectly valid and semantic HTML? That seems wrong.
> >>
> >> That seems really weird, because, after all, it's perfectly valid and
> >> Plain Old Semantic HTML.
> >>
> >> I'd love to hear your opinions.
> >>
> >> Roel
> >>
> >> --
> >> Roel Van Gils
> >> Inclusive Design & Accessibility Consultant
> >>
> >> Tel.: +32 473 88 18 06 <+32%20473%2088%2018%2006>
> >> Skype: roelvangils
> >> Twitter: twitter.com/roelvangils
> >> LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/roelvangils
> >>
> >>
> >> > >> > >> archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> >> > >> > >> > >> archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> >> > >> > >> > >> archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> >> > >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Sailesh Panchang
> > Principal Accessibility Consultant
> > Deque Systems Inc
> > Phone 703-225-0380 ext 105 <(703)%20225-0380>
> > Mobile: 571-344-1765 <(571)%20344-1765>
> > > > > > archives at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > >
> > > at http://webaim.org/discussion/archives
> > > > > >
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