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Thread: Web Accessibility Validators - Experience survey
Number of posts in this thread: 5 (In chronological order)
From: Gaspar Rajoy
Date: Thu, Jul 31 2014 6:08AM
Subject: Web Accessibility Validators - Experience survey
No previous message | Next message →
Hello everyone!
I'm from Argentina, and I'm about to finish my Degree. To make that
possible, I'm doing a thesis of Accessibility Validators, and implementing
a completely new concept in Accessibility Validation of W3C's WCAG2 Rules,
written in Java. As part of the work, I have to do a deep research of the
current market offer in this matter. All I need from you, is to complete a
form (link provided at the end) with a few questions about your experience,
your thoughts and what do you expect from a validator to provide (if you
have experienced some of the validators, and you are working with Web
Accessibility).
Sincerely, I really appreciate your help.
------------------------------
Hola a todos! Soy de Argentina, y estoy a punto de terminar mi tesis de
grado. Para hacer eso posible, estoy haciendo un trabajo de investigación
sobre Validadores de Accesibilidad Web, e implementado un nuevo concepto en
Validación de Accesibilidad Web basado en las reglas WCAG2 de la W3C,
escrito en Java. Como parte de dicho trabajo, necesito hacer una
investigación sobre la oferta de mercado actual, en materia de validadores
existentes.
Lo que necesito de ustedes, es que completen un formulario (enlace provisto
al final) con un par de preguntas acerca de su experiencia con validadores
de accesibilidad, qué piensan y qué caracterÃsticas creen que éstos
deberÃan tener (si aplica, ya que puede que nunca hayan trabajado con este
tipo de herramientas).
*El formulario se encuentra en inglés, pero si necesitan tenerlo en
español, por favor me avisan asà les proveo la versión traducida.*
Sinceramente agradezco el tiempo y la ayuda de todos ustedes.
Web Accessibility Validators - Form
<https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1pAPGb3dgSgoXpNhWaaSOQSVq4c_7Ts6Rg3e95mTvH-0/viewform?usp=send_form>
--
*-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
From: Karl Groves
Date: Thu, Jul 31 2014 8:12AM
Subject: Re: Web Accessibility Validators - Experience survey
← Previous message | Next message →
Gaspar,
Not to take the wind out of your sails, but you may want to do a more
thorough evaluation of the tools available on the market as well as a more
informed study of evaluation methods overall and the various use cases for
accessibility testing tools and for automated software testing in general
I say this because of the rather small number of tools in your survey and
the choices of tools in your survey. For instance, at least one of those
tools only tests WCAG 1.0.
Some helpful links for you
http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/ - thats the evaluation and repair tools WG at W3C
http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/WD-AERT/ED-AERT - that's a recent document
they've published a document that provides an overview of potential
features of tools.
Also, taking an opportunity to rant a little:
Something that I feel is currently holding accessibility back is the
continuing ignorance of software QA outside of accessibility. The continued
creation and use of standalone testing systems prevents the mainstreaming
of accessibility in development processes.
2014-07-31 8:08 GMT-04:00 Gaspar Rajoy < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >:
> Hello everyone!
>
> I'm from Argentina, and I'm about to finish my Degree. To make that
> possible, I'm doing a thesis of Accessibility Validators, and implementing
> a completely new concept in Accessibility Validation of W3C's WCAG2 Rules,
> written in Java. As part of the work, I have to do a deep research of the
> current market offer in this matter. All I need from you, is to complete a
> form (link provided at the end) with a few questions about your experience,
> your thoughts and what do you expect from a validator to provide (if you
> have experienced some of the validators, and you are working with Web
> Accessibility).
>
> Sincerely, I really appreciate your help.
> ------------------------------
>
> Hola a todos! Soy de Argentina, y estoy a punto de terminar mi tesis de
> grado. Para hacer eso posible, estoy haciendo un trabajo de investigación
> sobre Validadores de Accesibilidad Web, e implementado un nuevo concepto en
> Validación de Accesibilidad Web basado en las reglas WCAG2 de la W3C,
> escrito en Java. Como parte de dicho trabajo, necesito hacer una
> investigación sobre la oferta de mercado actual, en materia de validadores
> existentes.
>
> Lo que necesito de ustedes, es que completen un formulario (enlace provisto
> al final) con un par de preguntas acerca de su experiencia con validadores
> de accesibilidad, qué piensan y qué caracterÃsticas creen que éstos
> deberÃan tener (si aplica, ya que puede que nunca hayan trabajado con este
> tipo de herramientas).
>
> *El formulario se encuentra en inglés, pero si necesitan tenerlo en
> español, por favor me avisan asà les proveo la versión traducida.*
>
> Sinceramente agradezco el tiempo y la ayuda de todos ustedes.
>
> Web Accessibility Validators - Form
> <
> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1pAPGb3dgSgoXpNhWaaSOQSVq4c_7Ts6Rg3e95mTvH-0/viewform?usp=send_form
> >
> --
>
>
> *-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
> > > >
--
Karl Groves
www.karlgroves.com
@karlgroves
http://www.linkedin.com/in/karlgroves
Phone: +1 410.541.6829
www.tenon.io
What is this thing and what does it do?
http://vimeo.com/84970341
http://lanyrd.com/profile/karlgroves/
From: Gaspar Rajoy
Date: Thu, Jul 31 2014 8:19AM
Subject: Re: Web Accessibility Validators - Experience survey
← Previous message | Next message →
Hi Karl!
Thanks for the feedback.
Yes, we have reduced the list because I'm evaluating those validators; but
yes, I have to look further. Anyway, (correct me if I'm wrong) WCAG 1 can't
be automatically validated; it has to be manually checked.
Anyway, the base of this is that I'm developing a new concept in
Accessibility Validation, so when I have a preview, I'll share to all of
you.
Thanks again, Karl
On 31 July 2014 11:12, Karl Groves < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Gaspar,
>
> Not to take the wind out of your sails, but you may want to do a more
> thorough evaluation of the tools available on the market as well as a more
> informed study of evaluation methods overall and the various use cases for
> accessibility testing tools and for automated software testing in general
>
> I say this because of the rather small number of tools in your survey and
> the choices of tools in your survey. For instance, at least one of those
> tools only tests WCAG 1.0.
>
> Some helpful links for you
>
> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/ - thats the evaluation and repair tools WG at
> W3C
>
> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/WD-AERT/ED-AERT - that's a recent document
> they've published a document that provides an overview of potential
> features of tools.
>
>
> Also, taking an opportunity to rant a little:
> Something that I feel is currently holding accessibility back is the
> continuing ignorance of software QA outside of accessibility. The continued
> creation and use of standalone testing systems prevents the mainstreaming
> of accessibility in development processes.
>
>
>
> 2014-07-31 8:08 GMT-04:00 Gaspar Rajoy < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >:
>
> > Hello everyone!
> >
> > I'm from Argentina, and I'm about to finish my Degree. To make that
> > possible, I'm doing a thesis of Accessibility Validators, and
> implementing
> > a completely new concept in Accessibility Validation of W3C's WCAG2
> Rules,
> > written in Java. As part of the work, I have to do a deep research of the
> > current market offer in this matter. All I need from you, is to complete
> a
> > form (link provided at the end) with a few questions about your
> experience,
> > your thoughts and what do you expect from a validator to provide (if you
> > have experienced some of the validators, and you are working with Web
> > Accessibility).
> >
> > Sincerely, I really appreciate your help.
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Hola a todos! Soy de Argentina, y estoy a punto de terminar mi tesis de
> > grado. Para hacer eso posible, estoy haciendo un trabajo de investigación
> > sobre Validadores de Accesibilidad Web, e implementado un nuevo concepto
> en
> > Validación de Accesibilidad Web basado en las reglas WCAG2 de la W3C,
> > escrito en Java. Como parte de dicho trabajo, necesito hacer una
> > investigación sobre la oferta de mercado actual, en materia de
> validadores
> > existentes.
> >
> > Lo que necesito de ustedes, es que completen un formulario (enlace
> provisto
> > al final) con un par de preguntas acerca de su experiencia con
> validadores
> > de accesibilidad, qué piensan y qué caracterÃsticas creen que éstos
> > deberÃan tener (si aplica, ya que puede que nunca hayan trabajado con
> este
> > tipo de herramientas).
> >
> > *El formulario se encuentra en inglés, pero si necesitan tenerlo en
> > español, por favor me avisan asà les proveo la versión traducida.*
> >
> > Sinceramente agradezco el tiempo y la ayuda de todos ustedes.
> >
> > Web Accessibility Validators - Form
> > <
> >
> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1pAPGb3dgSgoXpNhWaaSOQSVq4c_7Ts6Rg3e95mTvH-0/viewform?usp=send_form
> > >
> > --
> >
> >
> > *-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
> > > > > > > >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Karl Groves
> www.karlgroves.com
> @karlgroves
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/karlgroves
> Phone: +1 410.541.6829
>
> www.tenon.io
>
> What is this thing and what does it do?
> http://vimeo.com/84970341
>
> http://lanyrd.com/profile/karlgroves/
> > > >
--
*-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
From: Karl Groves
Date: Thu, Jul 31 2014 8:42AM
Subject: Re: Web Accessibility Validators - Experience survey
← Previous message | Next message →
"Yes, we have reduced the list because I'm evaluating those validators"
This is, IMO at least, a bad idea. Again because
"Anyway, (correct me if I'm wrong) WCAG 1 can't be automatically validated;
it has to be manually checked."
This statement is inaccurate for two reasons: First is that WCAG 1 has
been obsoleted by WCAG 2.0. The difference is important and you should be
familiar with WCAG 2.0 before continuing your research.
There are things which can be definitively tested using automated means,
things that can be tested automatically but must be verified by a skilled
tester, and things that can only be checked manually.
http://www.karlgroves.com/2012/09/15/accessibility-testing-what-can-be-tested-and-how/
Ultimately accessibility *is* a user experience challenge, and therefore
"accessibility" is determined by how usable the system is. The unique
portion of accessibility is the higher contribution of technical factors.
This makes the use of automated or semi-automated testing more valuable for
evaluating accessibility.
On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 10:19 AM, Gaspar Rajoy < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> Hi Karl!
>
> Thanks for the feedback.
>
> Yes, we have reduced the list because I'm evaluating those validators; but
> yes, I have to look further. Anyway, (correct me if I'm wrong) WCAG 1 can't
> be automatically validated; it has to be manually checked.
>
> Anyway, the base of this is that I'm developing a new concept in
> Accessibility Validation, so when I have a preview, I'll share to all of
> you.
>
> Thanks again, Karl
>
>
> On 31 July 2014 11:12, Karl Groves < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> > Gaspar,
> >
> > Not to take the wind out of your sails, but you may want to do a more
> > thorough evaluation of the tools available on the market as well as a
> more
> > informed study of evaluation methods overall and the various use cases
> for
> > accessibility testing tools and for automated software testing in general
> >
> > I say this because of the rather small number of tools in your survey and
> > the choices of tools in your survey. For instance, at least one of those
> > tools only tests WCAG 1.0.
> >
> > Some helpful links for you
> >
> > http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/ - thats the evaluation and repair tools WG at
> > W3C
> >
> > http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/WD-AERT/ED-AERT - that's a recent document
> > they've published a document that provides an overview of potential
> > features of tools.
> >
> >
> > Also, taking an opportunity to rant a little:
> > Something that I feel is currently holding accessibility back is the
> > continuing ignorance of software QA outside of accessibility. The
> continued
> > creation and use of standalone testing systems prevents the mainstreaming
> > of accessibility in development processes.
> >
> >
> >
> > 2014-07-31 8:08 GMT-04:00 Gaspar Rajoy < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >:
> >
> > > Hello everyone!
> > >
> > > I'm from Argentina, and I'm about to finish my Degree. To make that
> > > possible, I'm doing a thesis of Accessibility Validators, and
> > implementing
> > > a completely new concept in Accessibility Validation of W3C's WCAG2
> > Rules,
> > > written in Java. As part of the work, I have to do a deep research of
> the
> > > current market offer in this matter. All I need from you, is to
> complete
> > a
> > > form (link provided at the end) with a few questions about your
> > experience,
> > > your thoughts and what do you expect from a validator to provide (if
> you
> > > have experienced some of the validators, and you are working with Web
> > > Accessibility).
> > >
> > > Sincerely, I really appreciate your help.
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Hola a todos! Soy de Argentina, y estoy a punto de terminar mi tesis de
> > > grado. Para hacer eso posible, estoy haciendo un trabajo de
> investigación
> > > sobre Validadores de Accesibilidad Web, e implementado un nuevo
> concepto
> > en
> > > Validación de Accesibilidad Web basado en las reglas WCAG2 de la W3C,
> > > escrito en Java. Como parte de dicho trabajo, necesito hacer una
> > > investigación sobre la oferta de mercado actual, en materia de
> > validadores
> > > existentes.
> > >
> > > Lo que necesito de ustedes, es que completen un formulario (enlace
> > provisto
> > > al final) con un par de preguntas acerca de su experiencia con
> > validadores
> > > de accesibilidad, qué piensan y qué caracterÃsticas creen que éstos
> > > deberÃan tener (si aplica, ya que puede que nunca hayan trabajado con
> > este
> > > tipo de herramientas).
> > >
> > > *El formulario se encuentra en inglés, pero si necesitan tenerlo en
> > > español, por favor me avisan asà les proveo la versión traducida.*
> > >
> > > Sinceramente agradezco el tiempo y la ayuda de todos ustedes.
> > >
> > > Web Accessibility Validators - Form
> > > <
> > >
> >
> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1pAPGb3dgSgoXpNhWaaSOQSVq4c_7Ts6Rg3e95mTvH-0/viewform?usp=send_form
> > > >
> > > --
> > >
> > >
> > > *-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Karl Groves
> > www.karlgroves.com
> > @karlgroves
> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/karlgroves
> > Phone: +1 410.541.6829
> >
> > www.tenon.io
> >
> > What is this thing and what does it do?
> > http://vimeo.com/84970341
> >
> > http://lanyrd.com/profile/karlgroves/
> > > > > > > >
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> *-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
> > > >
--
Karl Groves
www.karlgroves.com
@karlgroves
http://www.linkedin.com/in/karlgroves
Phone: +1 410.541.6829
www.tenon.io
What is this thing and what does it do?
http://vimeo.com/84970341
http://lanyrd.com/profile/karlgroves/
From: Gaspar Rajoy
Date: Thu, Jul 31 2014 8:51AM
Subject: Re: Web Accessibility Validators - Experience survey
← Previous message | No next message
Yes, I agree with you.
I am very familiar with WCAG 2.0, that's why I said that about WCAG 1.0.
If you look al W3C's specification, you'll find Rules for WCAG 2; WCAG1
doesn't have rules.
I'm writing my rules based on this: http://oaa-accessibility.org
Thanks for the link, very useful.
On 31 July 2014 11:42, Karl Groves < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> "Yes, we have reduced the list because I'm evaluating those validators"
> This is, IMO at least, a bad idea. Again because
>
> "Anyway, (correct me if I'm wrong) WCAG 1 can't be automatically validated;
> it has to be manually checked."
>
> This statement is inaccurate for two reasons: First is that WCAG 1 has
> been obsoleted by WCAG 2.0. The difference is important and you should be
> familiar with WCAG 2.0 before continuing your research.
>
> There are things which can be definitively tested using automated means,
> things that can be tested automatically but must be verified by a skilled
> tester, and things that can only be checked manually.
>
> http://www.karlgroves.com/2012/09/15/accessibility-testing-what-can-be-tested-and-how/
>
> Ultimately accessibility *is* a user experience challenge, and therefore
> "accessibility" is determined by how usable the system is. The unique
> portion of accessibility is the higher contribution of technical factors.
> This makes the use of automated or semi-automated testing more valuable for
> evaluating accessibility.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 10:19 AM, Gaspar Rajoy < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> > Hi Karl!
> >
> > Thanks for the feedback.
> >
> > Yes, we have reduced the list because I'm evaluating those validators;
> but
> > yes, I have to look further. Anyway, (correct me if I'm wrong) WCAG 1
> can't
> > be automatically validated; it has to be manually checked.
> >
> > Anyway, the base of this is that I'm developing a new concept in
> > Accessibility Validation, so when I have a preview, I'll share to all of
> > you.
> >
> > Thanks again, Karl
> >
> >
> > On 31 July 2014 11:12, Karl Groves < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> >
> > > Gaspar,
> > >
> > > Not to take the wind out of your sails, but you may want to do a more
> > > thorough evaluation of the tools available on the market as well as a
> > more
> > > informed study of evaluation methods overall and the various use cases
> > for
> > > accessibility testing tools and for automated software testing in
> general
> > >
> > > I say this because of the rather small number of tools in your survey
> and
> > > the choices of tools in your survey. For instance, at least one of
> those
> > > tools only tests WCAG 1.0.
> > >
> > > Some helpful links for you
> > >
> > > http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/ - thats the evaluation and repair tools WG
> at
> > > W3C
> > >
> > > http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/WD-AERT/ED-AERT - that's a recent document
> > > they've published a document that provides an overview of potential
> > > features of tools.
> > >
> > >
> > > Also, taking an opportunity to rant a little:
> > > Something that I feel is currently holding accessibility back is the
> > > continuing ignorance of software QA outside of accessibility. The
> > continued
> > > creation and use of standalone testing systems prevents the
> mainstreaming
> > > of accessibility in development processes.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 2014-07-31 8:08 GMT-04:00 Gaspar Rajoy < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >:
> > >
> > > > Hello everyone!
> > > >
> > > > I'm from Argentina, and I'm about to finish my Degree. To make that
> > > > possible, I'm doing a thesis of Accessibility Validators, and
> > > implementing
> > > > a completely new concept in Accessibility Validation of W3C's WCAG2
> > > Rules,
> > > > written in Java. As part of the work, I have to do a deep research of
> > the
> > > > current market offer in this matter. All I need from you, is to
> > complete
> > > a
> > > > form (link provided at the end) with a few questions about your
> > > experience,
> > > > your thoughts and what do you expect from a validator to provide (if
> > you
> > > > have experienced some of the validators, and you are working with Web
> > > > Accessibility).
> > > >
> > > > Sincerely, I really appreciate your help.
> > > > ------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Hola a todos! Soy de Argentina, y estoy a punto de terminar mi tesis
> de
> > > > grado. Para hacer eso posible, estoy haciendo un trabajo de
> > investigación
> > > > sobre Validadores de Accesibilidad Web, e implementado un nuevo
> > concepto
> > > en
> > > > Validación de Accesibilidad Web basado en las reglas WCAG2 de la W3C,
> > > > escrito en Java. Como parte de dicho trabajo, necesito hacer una
> > > > investigación sobre la oferta de mercado actual, en materia de
> > > validadores
> > > > existentes.
> > > >
> > > > Lo que necesito de ustedes, es que completen un formulario (enlace
> > > provisto
> > > > al final) con un par de preguntas acerca de su experiencia con
> > > validadores
> > > > de accesibilidad, qué piensan y qué caracterÃsticas creen que éstos
> > > > deberÃan tener (si aplica, ya que puede que nunca hayan trabajado con
> > > este
> > > > tipo de herramientas).
> > > >
> > > > *El formulario se encuentra en inglés, pero si necesitan tenerlo en
> > > > español, por favor me avisan asà les proveo la versión traducida.*
> > > >
> > > > Sinceramente agradezco el tiempo y la ayuda de todos ustedes.
> > > >
> > > > Web Accessibility Validators - Form
> > > > <
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1pAPGb3dgSgoXpNhWaaSOQSVq4c_7Ts6Rg3e95mTvH-0/viewform?usp=send_form
> > > > >
> > > > --
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Karl Groves
> > > www.karlgroves.com
> > > @karlgroves
> > > http://www.linkedin.com/in/karlgroves
> > > Phone: +1 410.541.6829
> > >
> > > www.tenon.io
> > >
> > > What is this thing and what does it do?
> > > http://vimeo.com/84970341
> > >
> > > http://lanyrd.com/profile/karlgroves/
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> >
> > *-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*
> > > > > > > >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Karl Groves
> www.karlgroves.com
> @karlgroves
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/karlgroves
> Phone: +1 410.541.6829
>
> www.tenon.io
>
> What is this thing and what does it do?
> http://vimeo.com/84970341
>
> http://lanyrd.com/profile/karlgroves/
> > > >
--
*-- Gaspar RajoyPhone: (+54) 9 (221) 5666077*