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Number of posts in this thread: 7 (In chronological order)

From: smithj7
Date: Sat, Oct 07 2006 12:00PM
Subject: ASP web application validation format
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I really need to talk to someone who nows visual studio's way of handling form validation. I have a great group of folks that want to make their application accessible but don't know how.

I took asp classes but now have to access to an iis server to test. Inline validation does not work for a speech user.

I was thinking that the error page might be able to redisplay with a new title - errors on form, and error box at the top of the page with access keys to the fields with errors using an unorder list, no focus on the form so the screen reader would read the page as a new page and discover it was an error page. Is something like this possible? If yes, could you tell me how to explain it to the programmers or send me to a page to find out how. I've exhausted the msnd library and wrote them because the Accessible Web Application Design Guide only links back to requirements not the how or a can't find the document from some other other links. Endless loop over and over again.

Any help in how I can help this group get their forms validated in accessible manner would be appreciated. I searched old achrives on this topic but didn't find responses that would be useful to this group.

From: Darrel Austin
Date: Sun, Oct 08 2006 12:20PM
Subject: Re: ASP web application validation format
← Previous message | Next message →

>
> I was thinking that the error page might be able to redisplay with
> a new title - errors on form, and error box at the top of the page
> with access keys to the fields with errors using an unorder list,
> no focus on the form so the screen reader would read the page as a
> new page and discover it was an error page. Is something like this
> possible? If yes, could you tell me how to explain it to the
> programmers or send me to a page to find out how. I've exhausted
> the msnd library and wrote them because the Accessible Web
> Application Design Guide only links back to requirements not the
> how or a can't find the document from some other other links.
> Endless loop over and over again.

By default, VS.net won't get you to where you want to go. You have to
work with developers that are willing to go beyond the drag-n-drop
interface methodology.

If we're talking about ASP.net, the built in controls aren't that
bad...obviously, just skip the client-side validation.

The validator controls allow you to enter your own HTML error
message, so you can make that rather semantic. In addition, you can
use a summary validator that will list each of the items that weren't
valid on their own, again, with its own custom HTML.

As for the title, that's a good idea, and a competant developer
should be able to do that.

If they're using ASP, they'll just have to do a bit more hand coding
to get the same results.

-Darrel

From: Peter Krantz
Date: Sun, Oct 08 2006 1:50PM
Subject: Re: ASP web application validation format
← Previous message | Next message →

On 10/7/06, smithj7 < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> I was thinking that the error page might be able to redisplay with a new title - errors on form, and error box at the top of the page with access keys to the fields with errors using an unorder list, no focus on the form so the screen reader would read the page as a new page and discover it was an error page. Is something like this possible? If yes, could you tell me how to explain it to the programmers or send me to a page to find out how. I've exhausted the msnd library and wrote them because the Accessible Web Application Design Guide only links back to requirements not the how or a can't find the document from some other other links. Endless loop over and over again.

I think you are on to the right track. I wrote about how to display
error messages a while ago:

http://standards-schmandards.com/index.php?2005/06/25/21

As for ASP.NET it depends on wihch version you are running. 1.1 has
lousy standards support and you have little use for the built-in
usercontrols that render HTML. If you focus on making sure the
server-side validation works as expected I would suggest you creat
your own user control to display validation errors.

Regards,

Peter

From: smithj7
Date: Mon, Oct 09 2006 5:30AM
Subject: Re: ASP web application validation format
← Previous message | Next message →

I am so glad that it is possible on the server side.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Darrel Austin" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
To: "WebAIM Discussion List" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] ASP web application validation format


> >
>> I was thinking that the error page might be able to redisplay with
>> a new title - errors on form, and error box at the top of the page
>> with access keys to the fields with errors using an unorder list,
>> no focus on the form so the screen reader would read the page as a
>> new page and discover it was an error page. Is something like this
>> possible? If yes, could you tell me how to explain it to the
>> programmers or send me to a page to find out how. I've exhausted
>> the msnd library and wrote them because the Accessible Web
>> Application Design Guide only links back to requirements not the
>> how or a can't find the document from some other other links.
>> Endless loop over and over again.
>
> By default, VS.net won't get you to where you want to go. You have to
> work with developers that are willing to go beyond the drag-n-drop
> interface methodology.
>
> If we're talking about ASP.net, the built in controls aren't that
> bad...obviously, just skip the client-side validation.
>
> The validator controls allow you to enter your own HTML error
> message, so you can make that rather semantic. In addition, you can
> use a summary validator that will list each of the items that weren't
> valid on their own, again, with its own custom HTML.
>
> As for the title, that's a good idea, and a competant developer
> should be able to do that.
>
> If they're using ASP, they'll just have to do a bit more hand coding
> to get the same results.
>
> -Darrel
>
>
>
>
>
>

From: smithj7
Date: Mon, Oct 09 2006 5:40AM
Subject: Re: ASP web application validation format
← Previous message | Next message →

I read and reread your article on how to make an accessible error message.
I can't wait to get to work, have the programers read it and try it out!
Thanks so much.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Krantz" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
To: "WebAIM Discussion List" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 3:43 PM
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] ASP web application validation format


> On 10/7/06, smithj7 < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>>
>> I was thinking that the error page might be able to redisplay with a new
>> title - errors on form, and error box at the top of the page with access
>> keys to the fields with errors using an unorder list, no focus on the
>> form so the screen reader would read the page as a new page and discover
>> it was an error page. Is something like this possible? If yes, could
>> you tell me how to explain it to the programmers or send me to a page to
>> find out how. I've exhausted the msnd library and wrote them because the
>> Accessible Web Application Design Guide only links back to requirements
>> not the how or a can't find the document from some other other links.
>> Endless loop over and over again.
>
> I think you are on to the right track. I wrote about how to display
> error messages a while ago:
>
> http://standards-schmandards.com/index.php?2005/06/25/21
>
> As for ASP.NET it depends on wihch version you are running. 1.1 has
> lousy standards support and you have little use for the built-in
> usercontrols that render HTML. If you focus on making sure the
> server-side validation works as expected I would suggest you creat
> your own user control to display validation errors.
>
> Regards,
>
> Peter
>
>
>
>

From: John Foliot
Date: Mon, Oct 09 2006 3:10PM
Subject: Re: ASP web application validation format
← Previous message | Next message →

smithj7 wrote:

> I was thinking that the error page might be able to redisplay with a
> new title - errors on form, and error box at the top of the page
> with access keys to the fields with errors using an unorder list, no
> focus on the form so the screen reader would read the page as a new
> page and discover it was an error page.

Accesskeys?

Using Accesskeys - Is it worth it? -
http://www.wats.ca/show.php?contentid=32
Accesskeys and Reserved Keystroke Combinations -
http://www.wats.ca/show.php?contentid=43

JF
---
John Foliot
Academic Technology Specialist
Stanford Online Accessibility Program
http://soap.stanford.edu
Stanford University
560 Escondido Mall
Meyer Library 181
Stanford, CA 94305-3093

From: smithj7
Date: Mon, Oct 09 2006 6:50PM
Subject: Re: ASP web application validation format
← Previous message | No next message

What great resouces!! John, I loved Stanford Online Accessibility Program,
and referred it to our DOE section that is trying to assure accessiblity. I
specifically recommended the article 10 "Must Read" articles on AJAX,
Accessibility and Web 2 technology
- http://soap.stanford.edu/show.php?contentid=65 but also recommended the
one one the errors, popups and the understanding how accessiblity technology
"reads" a site. I told the folks on gut insticnt to use access keys, but
didn't have a clue why. Your suggested articles are helping to understand
the reasons behind the suggestions.

Please know that your time and information is being used. I can't thank you
enough! I am passing on this information to the team working on a specific
program, trying to assimilate it to develop some formate to share it with
other folks in Florida. CA and FL currently have the most folks in the US
with visual impairments. Florida because of older users, CA because of
population alone. Unfortunately, most folks in our state appear to be far
behind what CA or many others are doing.

I wish I could spend a week with someone like you showing me hands on
examples. I have a hidden disability and learn from general from specific
and am a kinestic learner without the tools to test the ideas. Your
articles are helping to get a better grasp of what I call my "gut feelings".
It is giving me power to help these programmer make this particular program
better. I can't thank you and the folks on this list enough! Inch by inch
Florida is going to become a place that all users can actually have equal
access to the web. I just wished it was not so difficult! Thanks again.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Foliot" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
To: "'WebAIM Discussion List'" < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 4:57 PM
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] ASP web application validation format


> smithj7 wrote:
>
>> I was thinking that the error page might be able to redisplay with a
>> new title - errors on form, and error box at the top of the page
>> with access keys to the fields with errors using an unorder list, no
>> focus on the form so the screen reader would read the page as a new
>> page and discover it was an error page.
>
> Accesskeys?
>
> Using Accesskeys - Is it worth it? -
> http://www.wats.ca/show.php?contentid=32
> Accesskeys and Reserved Keystroke Combinations -
> http://www.wats.ca/show.php?contentid=43
>
> JF
> ---
> John Foliot
> Academic Technology Specialist
> Stanford Online Accessibility Program
> http://soap.stanford.edu
> Stanford University
> 560 Escondido Mall
> Meyer Library 181
> Stanford, CA 94305-3093
>
>
>
>
>
>