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Re: [EXTERNAL]Figures and Captions and Alt-text oh my...

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From: Jonathan Avila
Date: May 10, 2018 1:13PM

* Underneath the image of the painting is the title, size, and medium. Would it make sense to put this in a <caption>?
The Pastry Chef. 30" x 24". Acrylic on canvas.

Yes, I think this acts like a caption – so a figure and figure caption would be appropriate in my opinion.

Regarding the details, the hidden text seems to work well for screen reader users. Users with low vision are likely to miss details such as the accordion or the time on the clock, etc. and could also benefit from these. How you expose the details to the low vision user without giving them to all users would be tricky. Even with the hidden text example it wouldn't surprise me if that text shoed up in search results or something else. In fact it does, the below is what is seen in google when I search for some of the text

paintings. Arnie Lipsey, artist and filmmaker - I need a coffee<http://ineeda.coffee/arnie/paintings.html>;
ineeda.coffee/arnie/paintings.html
1.
Paintings. Arnie's grandfather decorating a cake. The Pastry Chef. 30" x 24". Acrylic on canvas. Mygrandfather applies the finishing touches to a crown-shaped cake in honour of George the fifth's coronation in 1937. Beside him on the floor is an accordion reflective of his fun loving "party guy" spirit. On the wall behind him is ...

Jonathan Avila
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From: Sandy Feldman < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Sent: Tuesday, May 8, 2018 7:21 PM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < <EMAIL REMOVED> >; Jonathan Avila < <EMAIL REMOVED> >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] [EXTERNAL] Re: Figures and Captions and Alt-text oh my...

hey Jonathan,

"the author doesn't want to prevent the user from making their own determinations" is exactly why the artist wants his descriptions hidden from the sighted user. That's well said. It's been very interesting for me to read these. It's given me an insight into these dreamlike images.

So, for example, the alt on one of the images is alt="Arnie's grandfather decorating a cake"

Underneath the image of the painting is the title, size, and medium. Would it make sense to put this in a <caption>?
The Pastry Chef. 30" x 24". Acrylic on canvas.

And here is the visually hidden text, written by the artist:
"My grandfather applies the finishing touches to a crown-shaped cake in honour of George the fifth's coronation in 1937. Beside him on the floor is an accordion reflective of his fun loving "party guy" spirit. On the wall behind him is a Soviet propaganda poster extolling the benefits of collective farming, a reference to his radical past. A pair of muddy army boots betrays his desertion from the Lithuanian army."

Except for the alt none of this has any semantic tagging or ARIA labels. It's just plain old text, either hidden or displayed. It makes sense to me when I listen to it with Voice Over, but it would, wouldn't it?

I am wondering if it makes sense to people using a screen reader, and if there's a better way I could do it.

Sandy




On 2018-05-08 7:08 PM, Jonathan Avila wrote:
> I would also comment that in my opinion there is a difference > between alt text and a caption and they should be different. An > alternative provides a replacement for non-text content while a > caption associates the image with the content allowing for references > from the content. Alt text can also be useful to people with low > vision who might miss subtle details in the picture but do have some > sight. With art is difficult as what you see is subjective based on > your life's experience and the author doesn't want to prevent the > user from making their own determinations. In that since alt text > for art may be different from alt text for other images in that you > generally don't want to describe the image but the function. With > art you may want to describe the image and not express an > interpretation on the screen reader or any user. I suppose an > exception to this might be an art education class where you want to > communicate that. > > Jonathan > > Jonathan Avila Chief Accessibility Officer Level Access > <EMAIL REMOVED> <mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> > 703.637.8957 office > > Visit us online: Website | Twitter | Facebook | LinkedIn | Blog > > Looking to boost your accessibility knowledge? Check out our free > webinars! > > The information contained in this transmission may be attorney > privileged and/or confidential information intended for the use of > the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this message > is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, > dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is > strictly prohibited. > >