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RE: Visible skip navigation links, was: good example

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From: Jim Thatcher
Date: Nov 13, 2003 10:17AM


I don't think the 508 provision on skip navigation is puts the whole burden
on the author any more than the requirement to provide text equivalents.



I totally agree that a structured approach makes much more sense and I would
be delighted to see authors and browsers collaborate to provide such cool
navigation.



For now, however, I look for techniques to allow users to jump around the
page. The major screen readers and HPR have, somehow, fixed the problem I
raised (skip links often don't work with the tab key); so you might say that
the user agents and author team up to make it work. But often, as I
indicated with acb.org, it doesn't work without the AT.



Jim

Accessibility, What Not to do: http://jimthatcher.com/whatnot.htm.

Web Accessibility Tutorial: http://jimthatcher.com/webcourse1.htm.




-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Gunderson [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ]
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 10:36 AM
To: Jim Thatcher
Cc: <EMAIL REMOVED>
Subject: RE: Visible skip navigation links, was: good example



Jim Thatcher points out the fundamental problem with the skip

navigation requirement of Section 508. Putting the whole burden on the
author will

always lead to browser compatibility issues. It should be a shared

burden. Authors should be required to use some markup like the MAP

element (which can use text links) to indicated collections of related links
on a pages (often

there are more than one navigation bar on a page) and browsers should be

required to allow users to either move keyboard focus over the links

contained in the MAP elements or move to the first link of a navigation

bar. This allows for users to not only skip over navigation bars, but

allows them to skip to a navigation bar if they waant to go to a different

link.



Jon





On Thu, 13 Nov 2003, Jim Thatcher wrote:



> Has anyone tried the visible skip link at, say, http://www.acb.org? Tab to

> "skip navigation links," press enter to follow the link and then tab
again.

> Oops! My version of IE on Windows XP puts the selection back on the skip

> link. I believe it is a fundamental bug in IE. Basically, in-page links

> don't work correctly.

>

> It seems, as we discuss solutions like skipping navigation, we ought to be

> sure they work as expected. The frustration of navigating the web must be

> heightened and aggravated when presented "solutions" just don't work.

>

> There are a couple of work-arounds that I know about. Make the named
anchor,

> actually an empty link - this is annoying for some but most reliable. It

> seems also that when the named anchor is in a table cell, then tabbing

> works.

>

> Jim

> Accessibility, What Not to do: http://jimthatcher.com/whatnot.htm.

> Web Accessibility Tutorial: http://jimthatcher.com/webcourse1.htm.

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Stephanie Sullivan [mailto: <EMAIL REMOVED> ]

> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 8:29 AM

> To: <EMAIL REMOVED>

> Subject: Re: Visible skip navigation links, was: good example

>

> on 11/13/03 8:19 AM, Karl Groves at <EMAIL REMOVED> profoundly spewed

> forth their very articulate thoughts:

>

> > You're saying that those with motor impairments can use the skip link as
a

> > method to more quickly get to in-context links?

>

> That's what I've been trying to say... And Andrew said it SO much
better...

> ;) Screenreaders (used mainly for sight impairment) can use both visual
and

> Tom Gilder-type skip links... So can people who surf by tabbing through
web

> pages (used mainly for motor impairment ... Or as someone else pointed
out,

> when you break your mouse. ;).

>

> The people who DON'T have any use for a skip link are the elderly who use
a

> mouse and are trying to click on the 1 x 1 skiplink (as the original
example

> said)... That would not happen because a person, surfing visually, using a

> mouse, will not have any use for a skip link. They will place their mouse
in

> the page at the place they want to go to (or link they wan to click)...

>

> This is all I've been trying to say from the beginning... ;) Thanks
Andrew.

> :D

>

> Stephanie Sullivan

>

> Contributing Author .: "Macromedia Dreamweaver MX 2004 Magic" :. New
Riders

> CommunityMX Team Member :: http://www.communitymx.com

> Technical Editor .: "DreamweaverMX Killer Tips" :. New Riders

> VioletSky Design :: http://www.violetsky.net

>

> "Happiness lies in the joy of achievement and the thrill of creative

> effort." --Franklin D. Roosevelt

>

>

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